Edmund Connelly’s current TOO article “Farewell, My Dear WASP” again raises the conundrum of why the WASPs collectively abdicated their position of power in the US. He mentions the Stockholm Syndrome and other possibilities — all of which should provide for an interesting discussion here. What strikes me most is the quote from Scott McConnell’s review:
While trying to impress an older girl, his summer tutor in Greek, he blurted out something mildly anti-Semitic. The young woman dryly replied that she was in fact “a New York Jew.” Gilder was mortified. He relates that he has never quite gotten over the episode. It is the kind of thing a sensitive person might long remember. Variations on this pattern are not uncommon in affluent WASP circles to this day: guilt or embarrassment at some stupid but essentially trivial episode of social anti-Semitism serve as a spur for fervent embrace of Likud-style Zionism. Atonement.
This severe proneness to guilt has always struck me as the defining feature of the Puritan strand of American culture. And with excessive guilt comes moralistic aggression aimed at ingroups and outgroups alike. As I noted elsewhere, the Puritans have a unique ethnic background among Anglo-Saxons generally. They have a strong tendency toward moral idealism, whether expressed as opposition to slavery in the 19th century, or as anti-anti-Semitism in the 21st. Puritans waged holy war on behalf of moral righteousness even against their own cousins — perhaps a form of altruistic punishment as the term is used in the scientific literature.
Once Europeans were convinced that their own people were morally bankrupt, any and all means of punishment should be used against their own people. Rather than see other Europeans as part of an encompassing ethnic and tribal community, fellow Europeans were seen as morally blameworthy and the appropriate target of altruistic punishment. For Westerners, morality is individualistic—violations of communal norms . . . are punished by altruistic aggression.
And since Gilder has never quite forgiven himself for a minor ethnic slur, he has become a soldier on behalf of righteousness. Like a Puritan magistrate of old, he is ready to do battle against the sinners among his own people. Of course, in the current environment, people like Gilder also benefit in terms of fame and fortune. But their feelings of moral righteousness make them feel good about what they are doing. Happiness for a Puritan is when self-interest coincides with a feeling of moral righteousness.
Once Jewish intellectuals achieved the moral high ground in the US and elsewhere, people like Gilder lost their resolve to defend their own ethnic interests; the game was over. Fundamentally, we have to stamp out Puritanism among Whites, or at least find a form of therapy for people like Gilder:
Given this state of affairs, what sorts of therapy might one suggest? To an evolutionary psychologist, this moralistic aggression seems obviously adaptive for maintaining the boundaries and policing the behavior of a close-knit group. … Groups of Angles, Jutes, and their Puritan descendants doubtlessly benefited greatly from moralistic aggression because of its effectiveness in enforcing group norms and punishing cheaters and defectors. There is nothing inherently wrong with moralistic aggression. The key is to convince whites to alter their moralistic aggression in a more adaptive direction in light of Darwinism.
The ultimate irony is that without altruistic whites willing to be morally outraged by violations of multicultural ideals, the multicultural New Jerusalem is likely to revert to a Darwinian struggle for survival among the remnants. But the high-minded descendants of the Puritans [like George Gilder] won’t be around to witness it.
The Joys of Jihad: Islamentable, Isatrocious, Isbetrayal
Nordics versus Implicit Jews in "The Switch"
Well that can backfire too -if wasps really do have this deep ingrained sense of justice what will happen when they realize what the jewish elite are doing?
I don’t think ANY of this is because of WASP guilt – but a realization of near-absolute jewish power in every important american institution – from wall street to the ivy leagues to Washington.
If WASPs were really ‘guilty’ and driven by a sense of right and wrong they would be taking up the cause of white Americans and Palestininians.
OK, that said, my parents are what would have been called blue book ivy educated WASPs who graduated from the ivies just before the collapse of WASP society (say 1959) and though divorced and on other sides of the political spectrum they are indeed hyper-philio semetic. even though my grandmother was anything but (incidently when it comes to dealing with jews I am more like her than my parents).
Here is one reason WASPs are silent and complicit in our own destruction. In the following article it is obvious the perps of this crime should be ajudicated for vandalism. Yet they are treated as though they have done something so evil it is on the same level as the “evil” of anti semitism.
This is powerful psychological stuff and to bring the entire cultural and legal apparatus down upon the heads of these people will certainly cure them of any desire to get rid of the Muslim even tho they never consented to them being here and they know only too well what will happen when Muslims get enough power to force their will upon us.
These people have to resort to vandalism because Muslims have more say in our government than we do. Its the situation we find ourselves in that is sick. So the question is how do we help those who wish to fight back and how do we facilitate a rebellion and protect our people?
Article
Investigation is underway about a vandalism attack on a mosque in Nashville, Tennessee, which, police say, appears to be part of an apparent hate crime campaign.
Police said the windows and walls of the mosque were spray-painted with terms like “Muslims Go Home”, The Tennessean reported.
Salaad Nur, a board member at the mosque, said the individuals behind the vandalism also left a note containing a message laden with hate-speech and expletives.
Nashville Metro Police Sgt. Brooks Harris said that the state and federal authorities will help investigate the vandalism.
“The key issue is, we’re really looking at this together with our state and federal partners and doing everything we can to get to the bottom of this, prevent it, and if there’s a solvability factor, we’ll find it,” Harris told The Tennessean.
I can imagine a WASP fraternity at an Ivy League school the year after they admit their first Jew or Catholic. Now that moral aggression has to be directed away from the obvious outsider in their own midst, perhaps it will even be redirected at any members of the group who don’t want to admit more outsiders? Now the moral aggression can’t be used to police the behavior of the group either, because of course Jews and Catholics have different moral standards.
Now the frat boys graduate and go on to rule WASP America. Tagging along are a Jew and a Catholic. Imagine making policy in such a group. Is the Jew suggesting this out of interests of the WASPs in the group, or outsider Jews? Is the Catholic pushing this policy because the Pope said so? (Don’t take the illustration too literally, American elite Catholics don’t listen to the Pope about anything obviously. On the other hand, all those Catholic Mexicans…)
WASPs in America have only one country, one language, one loyalty. Jews and Catholics are by nature international and have dual loyalty to outside groups. Someone said that once the Puritans had lost physical control of Massachusetts, their system fell apart. That moral aggressiveness is now at the disposal of people who are, by definition, not WASPs, yet are still accepted as equals and even insiders.
An interesting place to look for the origin of that Puritan fanaticism and aggressiveness maybe the distillation of hard liquor in Europe. Severe alcoholism became rampant by the 1600s and all those fanatic Protestant sects that eventually became WASPs may have started out as virtual anti-alcohol groups. The selection happened when some of the most zealous moved to America. The abolitionists were often indistinguishable from the prohibitionists.
When the Germans came they brought their beer with them, and reasonably enough, resented that the WASPs wouldn’t make a distinction between their moderate use of beer and the liquor at the saloons, an institution which was considered as morally reprehensible as a crack house is today.
And before dismissing the intolerant moral fanaticism of the prohibitionists, consider that the drug trade has always, always, been linked to military invasions (England’s Opium Wars against China) and foreign social disruption (firewater destroyed the Indians).
So the Germans chose their beer and we got FDR. Pretty soon George Stephen Morrison was at the clubhouse with his Catholic and Jewish partners, drinking brandy and trying not to make any Jew jokes.
At it takes is one Jew, one Catholic, or one non-white, and it’s no longer a WASP group.
How clever! Why didn’t we think of this!
http://www.rebelnews.org/politics/middle-east/185750-palestinian-protesters-pose-as-navi-from-avatar
Take a good look at the Palestinians because this is what the Jew will do to us when they rule the New World Order.
me says:
If WASPs were really ‘guilty’ and driven by a sense of right and wrong they would be taking up the cause of white Americans and Palestininians.
I think generally in our circles guilt is given too much credit as an explanation for what we see. It’s completely the wrong word, both objectively and even subjectively. For example, in what sense can you objectively be guilty of the actions of someone else, whom you never knew, let alone authorized to act for you? The very idea that whites of today should feel guilty for the Holocaust or for slavery is ridiculous on its face. It is even ridiculous to think that they are able to feel such guilt. They literally had NOTHING to do with either event. That some of them may say they feel guilty is proof of nothing except maybe a susceptibility to hysteria. I don’t doubt they feel something, but guilt? C’mon, gimme a break! And certainly, subjectively, I don’t feel myself to be guilty at all. My own introspection reveals not a trace of guilt for either of those things.
That said, we are left with the task of explaining white complaisance in the face of their dispossession. If it’s not guilt, what is it? I would suggest that it’s just another facet of conformism: lemming see, lemming do. This is a powerful motivator of human action that should never be dismissed lightly, stemming, in evolutionary terms, from the high adaptive value of being a member of group.
Real guilt, as a motivating factor in human relations, seems to me to be a rare thing. In the first place, one would have to be deeply moral and ethical to feel such a thing, and frankly, most people are neither. Injecting guilt as an explanation here also is an abuse of the concept, for how can one honestly feel guilty for someone else’s actions? I question the sincerity, and perhaps the sanity, of any contemporary white who claims to feel guilty about slavery, or the Holocaust. Also, this usage of the word “guilt” makes the mass psychosis that has infected our people seem far too voluntary. Lemming psychology and a carefully calculated estimation of individual benefit provides a better explanation.
Finally, framing the issue as guilt is a poor rhetorical move. Accepting even the existence of such a thing as white guilt makes it difficult to resist demands for atonement. Again recurring to the Jewish model, the Jews wisely reject any accusation against them leveled on the basis of collective guilt. Only real guilt, of course, merits any attention to claims for atonement, and collective guilt ordinarily will not qualify. By not using the word “guilt” for collective or fake guilt, clarity of thinking is promoted.
There’s much more to it, as Michael Jones has explained at length. When they still mattered, the WASPs saw the Jews as allies against Catholic ethnics. Put simply, they were more afraid of Catholic demographics than Jewish politics. That alliance destroyed the WASPs, with the result that now you either see a WASP fawning pathetically on the Jews like Gilder does, or you don’t see a WASP at all in public life. That alone should expose the essential bad faith of those in racialist circles today who favor an alliance with Jews against Muslims or immigrants.
The power of modern mass media – radio, film, and tv – to shape opinion, define and control social status, and influence morality, explains a great deal of our predicament. It can be thought of as a psychological warfare weapon that revolutionized the battlefield in the same way ICBMs did physical war-fighting.
I bet the elite WASPs didn’t take radio, film, and tv all that seriously, and just didn’t see the attack coming. The TV especially has changed how Americans see themselves and what behaviors and considered good, who is high status and who is not, and a simple way to control the boundaries of debate – if it’s not on TV, it’s out of bounds.
Even if elite WASPs themselves weren’t influenced by tv, their families and communities and constituencies were. The elite WASPs never owned Hollywood, so they were written into the script as villains or clowns.
At the end of his essay, Connely holds up Bush One, and Averell Harriman as examples of the former WASP elite. But, how elite were either of those birds once you got past the money that had been made by their fathers? Some Jewish genealogists even are convinced that the Bush family had Jewish roots. Or Harriman’s father who started out as an office boy, and then clerk on Wall Street.
It would seem to me that the WASP universalist strain would be more from the Congregationalist/United Church of Christ. How they get away with it is beyond me—considering the rural conservative nature of many, if not most of their churches. Does Aunt Ethel know she is contributing to a church full of miscegenating sodomites? Think I’m kiddin’ –I’m not!
@G.S.Morrison, who wrote: “[1] WASPs in America have only one country, one language, one loyalty. [2] Jews and Catholics are by nature international and have dual loyalty to outside groups.”
If [1] is true, then it’s game over for WASPs. But, of course, WASPs in America have more in common with Germanic Europeans than with their fellow non-WASP Americans (and vice versa). American WASPs, therefore, also have multiple loyalties, and their (meta-)ethnic instincts should not stop at any national border. Don’t be ridiculous.
Dr. MacDonald,
This is off topic but Ian Jobling has criticized ethnic genetic interests and you in another article:
http://whiteamerica.us/index.php/articles/articles/the_irrelevance_of_ethnic_genetic_interests/
I know that Jobling shouldn’t be taken seriously. However, I thought that I should bring this article to your attention just in case you wanted to read or comment on his latest attack.
I agree with George. :)
George Stephen Morrison says:
The power of modern mass media – radio, film, and tv – to shape opinion, define and control social status, and influence morality, explains a great deal of our predicament. It can be thought of as a psychological warfare weapon that revolutionized the battlefield in the same way ICBMs did physical war-fighting.
I bet the elite WASPs didn’t take radio, film, and tv all that seriously, and just didn’t see the attack coming. [...]
Yes, absolutely. In fact, it’s clear even the Jews did not really see it coming. How could they? Who in 1910 could have envisioned something like “Avatar 3-D”? Or foreseen the invention of television? Or the growth of government, media, and education into a monolith of indoctrination, in which only one point of view with regard to race is ever allowed to be seen as legitimate? Not only were they not foreseen, but the pernicious influence of these things still aren’t fully appreciated even today, despite their horrendous effects.
We must face the fact that the growth of the entertainment industry of film and television, part of the global technological system’s mass communication techniques, has been an ecological disaster for the white race. It is through the agency of these techniques that non-white memes, suicidal in effect, have replaced white memes in white consciousness and are allowed to proliferate unchecked, without limit. These techniques suspend and de-activate reason. They successfully create artificial realities, and are persuasive at an unconscious level.
Nor is the problem with these modern media technologies is merely one of bad use. If the vast majority of white people can be shaped by them to believe anything, then they are inherently bad, and by their nature destroy freedom. We would like to construct a free society of white people who decide questions rationally, not a nation of lemmings who can be made to believe anything if only the pitch is crafted carefully enough. The vision of the kind of society most whites would consider ideal is impossible to reconcile with these highly developed means of technological persuasion, and as these techniques continue to be refined, it will become even more so.
Whoa, if he had to write a whole book to atone for one slur, you guys are gonna be writing encyclopedia collections!
However, I rather doubt Gilder is writing out of a sense of guilt or atonement. Here is the simple slave mentality we see all over the place in our culture these days: Christian Zionism, Kabbalism bracelets, etc., etc. Lame (and laughably successful) strivings to toady the favor of the ruling class.
The historian Niall Ferguson is another example in this very mold. I read his History of Finance, and it is explicitly and ridiculously philo-Judaic. He portrays Rothchild, a villain in most accounts, as a saint like figure. After reading his biography of Rothchild, I heard, Henry Kissinger is commisioning Ferguson to write his own official biography. I.e., he realizes it will be a hagiography.
As an antidote to “Israel’s brilliant technological vanguard”, please refer to Philip Giraldi’s recent article “Stealing Success Tel Aviv Style”.
Another great and informative article from Connelly.
Geiseric the post was meant more as a historical analysis, not a proposal for future activism. At this stage in history I don’t think divisions between Protestants and Catholics, or American and European, are all that relevant anymore in the grand scheme of things.
George Stephen Morrison – i think you nailed it, the ability of mass media to shape thought was thoroughly under-estimated or ignored by the WASPs, but it was bound to happen when you let a low ethics group into a high ethics culture- the jews sqaushed any gentile effort to establish film companies as sure as they squashed any effort by wasps to distribute diamonds..
Early on, with Birth of A Nation -jews saw just how dangerous mass media was in gentile hands they will NEVER LET us establish mass media. They will never stop to think like some ivy league wasps “gee its not fair we keep jews out of Yale’ ..
Our resident contrarian and fountain of unwisdom, Adam, is at it again attempting to disprove the well-established phenomenon of White guilt. One questions why this poster seems unable to recognize the power of shame and guilt as powerful motivators of human behavior (particularly Whites). Needless to say, Dr. MacDonald’s contrasting analysis strikes me as spot on.
I think that what is ironic about the situation is that White altruism was probably extremely adaptable for our existence up until the last several decades. One can imagine that Gilder’s intelligent ancestors were also the elite, possibly clan-leaders or feudal lords, whose intense altruism towards their subjects was a highly successful evolutionary strategy. Had Gilder lived in the early colonies, he would have probably been a well-known philanthropist of the Benjamin Franklin type, a true asset to his community and co-ethnics. This resulted in the civilizational success that led to the arrival of the Jews and the development of mass media, transforming the the invaluable asset of extreme altruism into a deadly weapon against the race that once benefitted so much from it.
However, it is probably also the case that not all of the “tall, lean WASPS” of Connelly’s article are of the same mold as Gilder. For every Gilder that is supported and patronized by the culture of critique, there are probably many others that are suppressed or ostracized in the Joseph Sobran/Pat Buchanan manner. Promising writers that are not “with the program” probably have little hope of arising anywhere in “Conservative” periodicals, unless they are willing to slavishly toe the line. Thus it stands to reason that the WASPs are still out there, but have been displaced from highly visual positions.
general discussion point:
a sense of guilt and a sense of justice are two different things, entirely.
@George
There is a Roman Catholic & Jew political alliance in Congress. The Congressional votes prove it. One of the most obvious issues demonstrating a Roman Catholic & Jew political alliance is immigration. Another area is any issue concerning Israel, or any Jew pushed political effort like hate crimes laws. Even when the agenda runs counter to general White Roman Catholic interests.
Jews are meeting in Germany as we speak to squeeze more money out of the Germans and we’re talking billions. The Germans of today may not be guilty of anything but Jews are still taking their money in reparations for The Holocaust just as they sit in the Federal Reserve and goldman Sacks and openly steal us blind.
Whites invent tv so that information can travel at the speed of light rather than the population getting news like it travels from the moon and the Jew is all over it so our progress is twisted into a propaganda machine that makes White people believe they are guilty of something evil when the only thing they’re guilty of is being great enough to become the target of the most evil devils who ever existed.
One explanation for why the jew dominates art in America could be that Degas used his art to critique the Jew at a time when the French were deeply concerned that Jews had too much influence in politics and finance in France. They learn. Then when they prey on the next successful White nation they use what they’ve learned and so they dominate American art. They are an international organism like an extra terrestial alien life form.
Why should we expect anything different from White Americans. We are propagandized from kindergarten through out our lives. With luck a few of us figure things out while everyone else gasps in horror with any critical comment against jews. Ohmygod you’re an anti semite as though they’re brain dead simpletons. Usually they have normal functioning brains except for the areas subjected to jew propaganda.
If only we did own major media then I believe we could save ourselves because all people could know what we know. Jews learned that they needed to control any media like art and artists and they gained control of tv before we knew what had happened.
Why didn’t we learn from our experience in Europe just as the jew did? The White disapora is world wide and through us the jews control the world. The irony is that its Jews who commit the things they then go on to make Whites feel guilty for. Next we’ll have to rebuild iran and eventually feel guilty for what we will do to them.
@me Birth of a Nation – good point, I had forgotten about that, even Wilson had officially promoted that and it inspired the second klan.
Let me propose a tangential theory: a certain segment of the WASP establishment did take radio, film, and television very seriously: the military, specifically the intelligence agencies. And that faction was perfectly willing to outsource the job to Jews, in a time when many WASPs, elite and middle class, considered the film and tv industry to be disreputable and culturally toxic. But military realities such as the need for effective propaganda for domestic consumption overpowered cultural concerns.
Now the Hollywood Jews have been brought “inside the tent” so to speak. What do they do?
An amusing question I’ve been pondering lately. Richard Nixon’s favorite movie was Dr Strangelove. Did Nixon get the joke?
The sole disagreement I have with Dr MacDonald is over his proposition that Jews are of higher IQ than Whites. I dispute that.
That aside, I do believe in evolution, and it is apparent that whites like Gilder are not Whites like we are, in that they do not harbor survival genes.
There is an interesting writer, H. Millard, who posits an new evolved White race, that is healthy in mind, body and spirit. That those of the present configuration or taxonomic classification, who are susceptible to MTV and other media and governmental propaganda on race are heading towards extinction. What will be left are those who are stronger, tougher, meaner, more intelligent.
This doesn’t bode well for the game plan of the Hive down the line. They think they’ve won…
Contrary to what so many good people — out of sheer terror of ‘Communism’ — think, Capitalism is not ‘free enterprise,’ an incentive for success, ‘a chance for all.’ Capitalism is trusts, speculation, parasitical usury. Capitalism is J. P. Morgan, Rothschild’s bank, ripping apart the nations like maddened swine. Capitalism is the Jewish frying pan in which culture is rendered down to the grease of money. Following it, as the night to day, is the thrice hotter Jewish fire of ‘Communism.’
–William Striker
Andrew says:
Our resident contrarian and fountain of unwisdom, Adam, is at it again attempting to disprove the well-established phenomenon of White guilt.
And you are at it again, assuming what is to be proved. Well-established? Maybe you don’t know the definition of this word either, just as you thought “disagreeable” meant something that you, personally, disagree with. The fact that it is established at all, let alone well-established, is precisely what I call into question.
One questions why this poster seems unable to recognize the power of shame and guilt as powerful motivators of human behavior (particularly Whites).
Explain how you can be guilty for something someone else did well before you were even born, and I’ll admit you have a point. Otherwise, you’re just spewing your usual nonsense.
It’s good that Kmac and some of the posters here are talking about the antecedents and philosophical precursors of the currently toxified, and generally self-destructive, Anglo/White mindset. The old adage of ‘truth or consequences’ is most pertinent here. If we don’t recognize basic biological truths, we will suffer the dire consequences; which is a no-brainer. The Puritan ideological strain has deeply poisoned the Anglo mindset, but evolved White personality characteristics have also deeply affected it, as well.
The average White is a walking paradox, with all of this racial and ideological baggage in conflict. White racial identity and sentiment waxes and wanes, but is generally weak to dormant. This unfortunate fact, in conjunction with our innate moral foibles, and our subornation to spiritual fantasies and ludicrous delusions, has made us the picture perfect population to be domesticated and harvested by out-group social parasites. This is the basic gist of the problem, most everything else is corroboration.
Weak post, Kevin. You’re on the wrong track here. Gilder for the most part is not of New England Puritan ancestry.
I have to agree more with Adam on this one.
Whites are Anti-White for the same that Black males with AIDS in Africa Rape Virgins: Because the dominant memes in society tell them it’s the desirable thing to do.
This is why the punishment of Racial Heretics is so elementally important to people with Anti-White agendas.
It provides a manufactured correlation between violating the advice of the dominant memes and loss of valued things like social status and the esteem of opinion leaders.
Sometimes this is supplemented by the infliction of harm on the heretic, as occurred in the hateful venom directed against the Dutch politician Pim Fortuyn, which only ended after it had inspired a mind-slave of the dominant memes to murder him.
Cold blooded murder is hardly my idea of an act inspired by “Guilt”.
Anti-Racist Whites are like the slaves of a cult, and they feel they will be blessed so long as they show the proper degree of homage to the Diversity God.
This homage is not driven by guilt, and is instead the product of the same mindless terror and slimly desire for self-preservation that inspired ancient Canaanite mothers to willingly sacrifice their own children up to Baal.
“Custom is the King of All.”
-Herodotus
me says:
general discussion point:
a sense of guilt and a sense of justice are two different things, entirely.
Yes, that’s why it’s important not to mistake the one for the other. If whites give to non-whites out of a sense of justice, then it’s noblesse oblige, the white man’s burden, and for doing it they receive (or should receive) society’s approbation, and ought to be repaid by gratitude on the part of the recipients, at the very least. But if this motivation is allowed to be misidentified as “white guilt”, then whites accept the status of criminals repaying a debt to people they have wronged. Then they are repaid each time not with gratitude, but with contempt, and a demand for even more reparations.
Adam,
“And you are at it again, assuming what is to be proved. Well-established? Maybe you don’t know the definition of this word either, just as you thought “disagreeable” meant something that you, personally, disagree with. The fact that it is established at all, let alone well-established, is precisely what I call into question.”
I urge you to tone down the rancor, my good fellow. You have called upon my very humble services to elucidate you on this matter, and I am most happy to oblige. White guilt is a common phenomenon actually.
“Explain how you can be guilty for something someone else did well before you were even born, and I’ll admit you have a point. Otherwise, you’re just spewing your usual nonsense.”
Ah, but I have brand new nonsense to spew! Here goes nothing. Psychologically, we do not need to commit an act to feel guilt. We can be conditioned with a collective sense of shame for just about anything, if we are taught this again and again and again and again…you get the picture. Do not the young Germans feel a deep sense of guilt for the Holocaust? They didnt participate in it, and neither did most of their parents. Yet they have seen movies, read books and been generally assaulted for their entire lives with images showing their people engaged in a horrid, horrible business. With such constant exposure, how can they not feel guilt for that? Likewise, Americans are taught from the cradle their responsibility for the plight of the blacks, and the crimes of Whites against humanity are a central subject in our education system. At least we do learn something in school though, eh?
Getting back to the article, Gilder feels a deep sense of guilt for things he is not personally responsible, but for which he sees his race as responsible (keeping Jews out of country clubs and other forms of discrimination). Guilt and shame are extremely powerful motivators, which are used as leverage by minorities and our Semitic friends to persuade Whites to acquiesce to their dispossession.
@G.S.Morrison: I just tried to point out that WASP-ethnic interests are transnational, just as Jewish ethnic interests are (even though Jews have their own ethnostate, their diaspora culture still dominates in the grand scheme of things).
In other words, WASPs in America do NOT “have only one country, one language, one loyalty.”
As for historical analysis, we live in a post-national era, in which nationhood/nationality is displaced by (trans-national/supra-national) race and ethnicity. Having said that, American WASPs have a special responsibility/possibility to change the course of events, as citizens of the most powerful country in the (Western) world.
Re N/A’s post that Gilder was not a WASP: What was his ancestry then? Connelly is clearly assuming he is a WASP. And he certainly looks like the sort of Yankee WASP whose moral sensibilities are described in the post. His Wikipedia entry shows New England upbringing, Exeter, Harvard, etc.
Gilder believes what he believes because there is no other choice but to believe. it. Dr. Drkmoon’s articles make the same point about artists…
The alternative? become a mel gibson, Prof. Macdonald, Walt and Miersheimer…
No, I still think Gilder’s just brown nosing. Distinction and financial rumuneration will follow acts in praise of Israel or Jewish movements/interests. Clever courtiers recognize this and capitalize on it.
On the other hand, those who “love honor more”, like Kmac, et al., face public disgrace and disapproval.
There is a whole litany of great people who are mis-identified as Jewish in this book: Friedrich Engels, Van Cliburn, or Glenn Gould, and Federico Faggin, does not appear to be Jewish on either side.
“keeping Jews out of country clubs and other forms of discrimination)”
Does anyone understand this?
What sane Gentile wants to join a Jewish club? Jewish clubs often tout their tolerant “openness” but my guess is they do this because they know few if any gentiles will ever seek to join.
It seems the desire to “break in” goes only one way. Why the hell did Jews EVER want to join wasp country clubs? The culture and social scene at such institutions is typically completely alien to all things Jewish. Even for many affluent wasps it is not all it is cracked up to be.
My only thought it is the Jewish instinct for self-perceived vindictive triumph. One has not successfully bragged about ones children unless a gentile is there to here it… One has only fully expressed ones culture if another’s culture has been defiled. (If a tree falls in the woods…) It seems being resented and disliked is the mother’s milk of Jewish solidarity and motivation (And they say we have psychological problems??)
I agree that the path to fame and fortune is to have the attitudes that Gilder has. THis is always a consideration. But I do think that Gilder’s moral sensibility makes him feel good about himself as he benefits in other ways from doing what he does. In his own self-concept, he is carrying on a moral crusade. So he sleeps well.
The University of Alabama – Huntsville massacre was white on black (and Indian). Two of the three dead are black. Do you suppose the media will start to play this angle?
when jews join said clubs, the places almost immediately lose their charm or their ethics sink…
Hamptons: once peaceful, countryside – now flashy, glitzy, tension and drama filled -
ivy leagues: produced gentlemen who were stewards and custodians of society – now – jews who looted russia, jews who advocate torture, etc.
clubs: all the sudden a menorah has to be next to the christmas tree..then the christmas tree has to go.. the place no longer becomes a place of tranquil harmony but of conflict, flash, and glitz.
I believe that assimilated german jews, who sometimes were memebers of these ‘wasp only’ clubs were the most adement about keeping the east european jews out, knowing their abrasiveness would cause problems.
Re N/A’s post that Gilder was not a WASP: What was his ancestry then? Connelly is clearly assuming he is a WASP. And he certainly looks like the sort of Yankee WASP whose moral sensibilities are described in the post. His Wikipedia entry shows New England upbringing, Exeter, Harvard, etc.
@admin
Re N/A’s post that Gilder was not a WASP: What was his ancestry then? Connelly is clearly assuming he is a WASP. And he certainly looks like the sort of Yankee WASP whose moral sensibilities are described in the post. His Wikipedia entry shows New England upbringing, Exeter, Harvard, etc.
—————–
How can you talk about New England Puritans’ without considering their church the United Church of Christ, the former Congregational Church. The Episcopal church would be more mid-Atlantic & Southern, not New England.
Do not the young Germans feel a deep sense of guilt for the Holocaust? They didn’t participate in it, and neither did most of their parents. Yet they have seen movies, read books and been generally assaulted for their entire lives with images showing their people engaged in a horrid, horrible business. With such constant exposure, how can they not feel guilt for that?
Let me add to these considerations, contra “Adam’s” thesis, a personal note in support of “Andrew’s” position.
I have been associated with someone who, for an extended period of my life, adopted certain completely false, delusional notions about me, which misconstructions that person constantly voiced and thus projected upon me.
Despite the ludicrous and baseless nature of those “accusations,” I had a distinct *feeling* of guilt that I could not altogether eliminate through rational reflection. Thus I must identify with Andrew’s submission that guilt can be effectively *projected* upon, and felt by, an innocent subject – just as can a weapon’s projectile.
“Re N/A’s post that Gilder was not a WASP: What was his ancestry then?”
I list his great-grandparents and discuss their ancestry in the linked post. Gilder appears to be as much Southron as Yankee by blood, and most of his ancestors came from the Mid-Atlantic region.
“Connelly is clearly assuming he is a WASP.”
“WASP” is merely a pejorative for “American”. It’s often used more narrowly to refer to perceived members of the native American upper class. It is not a synonym for “descendant of New England Puritan”, and membership in the America upper class was never restricted to those of English descent (much less New England descent). Besides English ancestry, Gilder has Scotch-Irish, Irish, Dutch, and French ancestry.
Gilder doen’t say he is a member of the United Church of Christ, or did I miss that?
The United Church of Christ, formerly called the Congreational church, is the direct descendent of the New England Puritans. Not the Episcopal Church.
The United Church of Christ is very universalist in outlook, almost unitarian, matter of fact the Unitarians are split from it.
“The key is to convince whites to alter their moralistic aggression in a more adaptive direction in light of Darwinism”
It seems they are Kantian inasmuch as doing something for an adaptive reason is disapproved of by virtue of being self-interested. The guilt and moralistic aggression is at self or others who are percieved as base for acting in their own self interest – even if it is in a general white interest -
rather than exercising effortful control to overcome themselves for the general good.
They don’t seem to apply the same standard to the 100% self-interested Jewish activism in the area of race and immigration though.
Gilder has quite a few clergymen in his family tree which is not without significance for a hypothesis which attributes a propensity to feel guilt.
Race, ethnicity, and attitudes toward inter-ethnic marriage
The Midlife Development in the United States Study asked Americans how important it is for members of their ethnic group to marry inside the group. Here are the percentages who said “very important” or “somewhat important” (N = 4,881):
Jewish 47.4
Asian 42.3
Amerindian 37.3
Black 34.6
Hispanic 33.8
English 28.4
French 19.7
Italian 19.1
Scottish 18.5
Irish 18.3
Polish 16.3
German 16.0
Swedish 15.8
Norwegian 15.2
http://inductivist.blogspot.com/2010/02/race-ethnicity-and-attitudes-toward.html
Andrew says:
Adam,
“And you are at it again, assuming what is to be proved. Well-established? Maybe you don’t know the definition of this word either, just as you thought “disagreeable” meant something that you, personally, disagree with. The fact that it is established at all, let alone well-established, is precisely what I call into question.”
I urge you to tone down the rancor, my good fellow.
Oh, I see. You wade in with your usual airy dismissal of my arguments, this time with a thinly veiled ad hominem which labels me a “fountain of unwisdom”, and my reaction — which seems to me quite moderate — you now call “rancor”.
Whatever.
“Explain how you can be guilty for something someone else did well before you were even born, and I’ll admit you have a point. Otherwise, you’re just spewing your usual nonsense.”
Ah, but I have brand new nonsense to spew! Here goes nothing.
Boy, ain’t that the truth.
Psychologically, we do not need to commit an act to feel guilt.
To the extent this is true, it is irrelevant. One might, for example, feel legitimate guilt about wanting to murder someone. But there is no argument that Gilder himself ever wanted to commit genocide against the Jews, or wanted to enslave negroes (the Holocaust and slavery being two common sources of the misnamed “white guilt”). Therefore, there’s no reason to call his particular neurosis “guilt”. In fact, we are ill-advised to do so, for the reasons I explained.
We can be conditioned with a collective sense of shame for just about anything, if we are taught this again and again and again and again…you get the picture. Do not the young Germans feel a deep sense of guilt for the Holocaust?
I can only think maybe you didn’t read what I wrote:
“That some of them may say they feel guilty is proof of nothing except maybe a susceptibility to hysteria. I don’t doubt they feel something, but guilt?”
You are dealing with my argument by ignoring it. Whether what Gilder (or young Germans) feel is properly described as guilt or not is exactly what I’m calling into question.
They didnt participate in it, and neither did most of their parents. Yet they have seen movies, read books and been generally assaulted for their entire lives with images showing their people engaged in a horrid, horrible business. With such constant exposure, how can they not feel guilt for that? Likewise, Americans are taught from the cradle their responsibility for the plight of the blacks, and the crimes of Whites against humanity are a central subject in our education system. At least we do learn something in school though, eh?
This manifestation of a conditioned response isn’t necessarily guilt, any more than the salivation of one of Pavlov’s dogs when a bell rings is properly described as “hunger”.
Getting back to the article, Gilder feels a deep sense of guilt for things he is not personally responsible, but for which he sees his race as responsible (keeping Jews out of country clubs and other forms of discrimination). Guilt and shame are extremely powerful motivators, which are used as leverage by minorities and our Semitic friends to persuade Whites to acquiesce to their dispossession.
Gilder feels something that he and others may describe as guilt, but that is only because, like you, they have only a hazy conception of what guilt is. What they are feeling is actually a neurosis, a conditioned response probably mixed to a degree with a rational calculation of the benefit to themselves that accrues by going along with this mischaracterization. To describe it as legitimate guilt justs feeds the problem. It’s like humoring a madman who claims that he is Napoleon by acting as though he actually is Napoleon.
The Jews are right, at least tactically, to reject collective guilt as applied to themselves. When someone tries to do that, then they very wisely insist that each Jew be judged only as an individual. What I am saying is that by acquiescing even to the possibility, let alone the existence, of collective “white guilt” for things such as the Holocaust or slavery, you lose. It’s a misapplication of the word “guilt”.
The next question that immediately suggests itself is why whites are so susceptible to this neurosis, which does not seem to afflict the Jews at all. I’d suggest it’s a result of two things. First, the Christian doctrine of original sin, which so far as I know is the first systematic elaboration of the idea of collective guilt, is deeply embedded in white culture. The widespread acceptance of this idea among whites set a very bad precedent. Second, the lack of racial cohesion characteristic of the white race, particularly in its interaction with this and other aspects of Christian doctrine, which encourages them to accept collective racial blame for something at the same time it discourages them from accepting collective racial credit for the good things their race has done. (I have in mind the sin of pride.) So KM is headed in the right direction when he says that the root of the problem is the Puritan influence, although actually it would be better to understand it as a psychological problem complicated by the pervasive Christian influence generally.
Junghans has put this another way, which I will close by quoting. Perhaps you may be better able to accept these things from someone other than me.
The Puritan ideological strain has deeply poisoned the Anglo mindset, but evolved White personality characteristics have also deeply affected it, as well.
The average White is a walking paradox, with all of this racial and ideological baggage in conflict. White racial identity and sentiment waxes and wanes, but is generally weak to dormant. This unfortunate fact, in conjunction with our innate moral foibles, and our subornation to spiritual fantasies and ludicrous delusions, has made us the picture perfect population to be domesticated and harvested by out-group social parasites.
Kevin et al.
Andrews commented: “Our resident contrarian and fountain of unwisdom, Adam, is at it again attempting to disprove the well-established phenomenon of White guilt.”
Adam made a good point. What we are dealing with is not aggregated individual guilt. Whether or not we want to call this collective sense, guilt, is another issue. Is original sin identical with collective guilt? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Original_sin For now, let’s defer this question to our theological department and focus on the collective aspect versus aggregated individual aspect.
There is a gestaltian sense to groupness. There is a sense of ‘us.’ White ‘Guilt’, as instilled by anti-racism, is a negative group image.
Looking at it this way expands our scope of analysis. We are not dealing with a bunch of individuals who feel bad about themselves. We are dealing with a bunch of individuals who have the choice of identify as something bad, identify as nothing, or try to redeem themselves. (Think: White Racists, White Liberal Conservatives aka Neocon led Libertarians, and White Liberal-Lefists). And we are dealing with other individuals who promote this anti-identity.
Most choose the later two options. Regrdless, for us the question is: how did the positive image get inverted and how does one revert it back — given the sociopolitical forces which are holding this in place?
Now the Nietzschean analysis would be that we went from: being Euopean was good (healthy) and being Christian was good (Moral); being non-European was bad (aestheticaly displeasing) and being non-Christian was evil (immoral) — to: being Multicultural is good (Moral) and being Cultural-Marxist is good (Healthy); and being European is evil (immoral) and being Christian is bad (suspect). You can look up his solution to this problem, or the equivalent he was dealing with.
For myself, I read Nietzsche like I read Jung; more as good literature. So I don’t take hi thoughts seriously. Regardless, we need to investigate the group-dynamic aspect of this condition, and go from there. Again, we are (mostly) not dealing with White persons who individually feel bad, but about persons who feel bad about being White people — in the sense of:
“You’re acting kinda white there, buddy”
The task is to moralize the survival of our people and to shame into silence those that oppose it. GW’s work at Majority Rights is instructive in that vein. And, after that, if they will not stop up their mouths in advocating our racial liquidation, there are others methods that can be pursued.
For those who commented on the invasion of WASP sancturaries such as the country club, you might be happy to know that the next installment of “Understanding Hollywood” (print version of Occidental Quarterly) focuses on films dealing with Jewish assaults on WASP mores at the country club.
For instance, there’s Caddyshack (1980), Caddyshack II (1988), and Happy Gilmore (1996).
I also address similar issues for Meet the Parents/Meet the Fockers.
For those who are fans of John Murray Cuddihy, this essay should be enjoyable.
Please subscribe to the print Occidental Quarterly to read it.
Yours,
Ed
I said “Now the Nietzschean analysis.” To tie this to KM, refer here:
http://books.google.com/books?id=PKZYW28zCjUC&pg=PA279&lpg=PA279&dq='Meine+Brueder,+sagte+der+aelteste+Zwerg,+wir+sind+in+Gefahr&source=bl&ots=RDa3sS79EY&sig=nvvPHKgcttlPGejaSCxG0mZaX5E&hl=en&ei=rLQSS4DgFsKWtgeBzonrCg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CAgQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=&f=false
Which roughly translates too:
“My brothers,” said the oldest dwarf, we are in danger. “I understand the mannerisms of this Giant; this great big fellow feels like doing his thing. When this number one takes a number ones, we will be eliminated; for when a giant takes a leak, we have a great flood. And I need not speak of what other horrible element we will be drowning in.”
“Problem,” said the second dwarf, “how does one keep a number one, from taking a number one.”
“Problem,” said the third dwarf, “how does one keep a Big Shit from being a Big Shit.”
“I thank you,” answered the oldest dwarf, in a dignified tone. “In so characterizing the problem as a twofold desire, the solution has become clear.”
“We must frighten him,” said the fourth dwarf.
“We must tickle him,” said the fifth dwarf.
“We must bite his toes,” said the sixth.”
“And we must do so all in union,” decided the oldest. “I see we have raised our low standing. This Great One will not piss all over us.”
From the article:
Consider that this man [Gilder] is the product of the best America has to offer—wealth, Exeter, Harvard, exposure to top leaders (he was a speechwriter for Richard Nixon), etc.
The decline of Harvard is the story of the white race in America, in microcosm. Harvard was a locus of abolitionist sentiment during the run up to the Civil War, and counted among its alumni one of America’s greatest writers, Henry David Thoreau, along with other, lesser lights such as James Russell Lowell. It was a kind of headquarters for the elites of the Northeast, the Puritan stock talked about by Tocqueville, that is so prone to “moralistic aggression” against its own kind, to put it in MacDonald’s terms. Emerson, Thoreau, Lowell, and the other transcendentalists were abolitionists who desperately wanted to believe in the equality of man, so much so that they let their idealism override the evidence of their own senses. Some of these abolitionists exceeded even the Jews in their fanatic efforts to encourage race mixing.
“The negro is superior to the white race. If the latter do not forget their pride of race and color and amalgamate with the purer and richer blood of the blacks they will die out and wither away in unprolific skinniness.”
–Henry Ward Beecher
Perhaps they can be forgiven, if only a bit, because at the time they lived they didn’t yet have the advantage of the insights of Charles Darwin, or any understanding of genetics. But this shows that white men of this stripe are entirely capable of causing their own genocide, without any help from Jews. Like American whites in general, they rip into their own with glee, and seem positively to relish the prospect of their own racial extinction.
Nevertheless, in spite of the fact that Harvard has been in a sense multicultural and anti-white at least since the time of Emerson, in the 1920s, there was at least SOME resistance to the Jew takeover, which is more than we can say of any modern university. A brief account can be found here:
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/anti-semitism/harvard.html
Lothrop Stoddard, a popular writer on race questions in the 20s, and one of the intellecutal powerhouses who supported the 1924 immigration cutoff, was also a Harvard man. Stoddard is an interesting case, too, because although he appears to understand that the Jews are non-white (he subscribes to the Khazar theory for the origin of the Ashkenazim, which has since been discredited by genetic evidence), and he fears Bolshevism, and he even makes the connection between Jews and Bolshevism, he’s not particularly anti-semitic. He barely mentions Jews in either The Rising Tide of Color or The Revolt Against Civilization. Ironically, this apostle of racial loyalty even stabbed the Nazis in the back. Wiki says this:
Stoddard was learned in many ways, and prophetic in others, but he had a lot of blind spots. When you take into consideration the state of science in his day, the blind spots are perhaps excusable. However, his soft-pedaling of the Jewish connection and apparent distaste for German oppostion to Jewry is especially curious. He appears to have been a very confused man. The fact that he seems to have regarded Bolshevism as a greater threat than Jews themselves strengthens me in my conviction that the WASP elites who ended up passing the 1924 immigration cutoff did it more from a sense of protecting their own elite status than any sense of white racial solidarity or anti-semitism, a solidarity and an anti-semtism which many of them were at pains to deny.
Another Harvard alumnus, T.S. Eliot, one of America’s greatest poets, was in attendance there at this time, and went on to pen the lines:
“My house is a decayed house,
and the jew squats on the window sill, the owner,
Spawned in some estaminet of Antwerp,
Blistered in Brussels, patched and peeled in London.
The goat coughs at night in the field overhead;
Rocks, moss, stonecrop, iron, merds.”
These lines and similar ones today have placed Eliot in disgrace among the politically correct, but they are very revealing. They show what was going on in the minds of our elites during the Jewish takeover. Unfortunately, our side lost that battle, and for familiar reasons: lack of racial cohesion, a failure of vision, a lack of a coherent ideology to provide a basis for resistance. Our house is indeed a decayed house, infested with Jew rats spawned in the sewers of Europe, and they now own it. America’s attempt to assimilate them has certainly proved intensely destructive, and quite probably fatal.
After its fall into Jewish hands, Harvard became the Jewish anus of the country, spewing its diarrhetic Jewish excrement over all and sundry. Further examples: The late Stephen Jay Gould, and Richard Lewontin, two Marxist Jews who both did so much damage to the concept of race, and obfuscate the clear insights of Charles Darwin. These Jewish scientists were little more than propagandists on the race question, support troops for the hugely destructive Jew Franz Boas (who also did a stint at Harvard.)
An extensive list of other notables who were graduated from the Harvard cesspit:
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Category:Harvard_University_alumni&from=A
Some standouts:
Harry Dexter White — major Jew rat and Soviet spy within the Roosevelt administration.
Edward M. Kennedy — the traitor who was a principal author and public face of the Immigration Reform Act of 1965. Clearly, Oswald shot the wrong Kennedy.
Douglas Feith — neocon Jew partly responsible for the Iraq debacle.
Jamie Gorelick — Clinton appointee partly responsible for the Fannie Mae collapse.
Noel Ignatiev — a Jew rat who obtained his degrees at Harvard, even though he did not meet the entrance requirements (being a member of the tribe has its advantages), and who now runs the racetraitor.org site, unabashedly dedicated to the genocide of the white race.
Viet D. Dinh — a first-generation immigrant. You may wonder, how did this guy slither off a fish-stinking boat and end up going to Harvard? We can of course be sure that it was all on the up and up – he did it strictly on his own merits! LOL. Of course he got into Harvard Law via the Affirmative Action machinery of white dispossession. From there he went on to become principal author of the Constitution-shredding PATRIOT Act.
Barack Hussein Obama — a graduate of Harvard Law, and who, on the basis of his negritude, was granted the sinecure of being the editor of its prestigious Law Review. A so-called “professor of Constitutional Law” (what a joke!) who has never written even so much as an article on any scholarly topic, let alone a book, this Affirmative Action student from Kenya is the well-spoken house negro of the Jews who now rules America with an iron paw, nationalizing its industries and institutions left and right.
Ruth Bader Ginsburg — an archetype of the Jew rat woman and a Ruth Buzzi look-alike, an internationalist leftist Supreme Court justice who also attended Harvard Law and edited its Law Review.
Stephen Breyer — a Jew rat (possibly only a half-Jew by genetics) on the Supreme Court, who has matured from a baby rat infesting the lower reaches of the judiciary to become a noteworthy source of intellectual subversion of the Constitution, providing any number of specious rationalizations for its destruction.
There are many others.
In spite of the freak exception represented by Mearshimer and Walt over at the Harvard School of Government, Harvard started out bad and has been getting worse and worse with each passing year. It’s very clear that if the Harvard of today were somehow to be obliterated from the face of the earth, and the entire student body, alumni, and faculty tossed into the deepest, blackest imaginable oubliette forever, it would be nothing but a great benefit and cause for celebration for the entire white race.
Also see:
http://www.vdare.com/roberts/mugabe.htm
http://www.vdare.com/roberts/harvard_genocide.htm
“a thinly veiled ad hominem which labels me a “fountain of unwisdom”,”
My dear sir, I apologize for the misunderstanding, which is my fault entirely. My reference to your alleged unwisdom was not in relation to this issue, but in reference to several of your previous commentaries. A few such gems: one post extolled the blessings of miscegenation for the “hybrid vigor” of our race, another hypothesized that Jew/Gentile relationship was “symbiotic”, while a more recent one went on at some length about the utter futility of White Nationalism. Let it be known that I stand guilty of finding your posts less than inspiring. Indeed, after contemplation, I confess that in the dark conspiratorial recesses of my mind, there arose a shadowy doubt, a sneaking, growing suspicion that you were not serving up silliness but rather a sinister souffle of sophistry and sabotage! It would indeed be a cunning scheme for one who sported a prominent proboscis, wore long forelocks and had occular beadiness; almost like something from the pages of an Agatha Christie novel! No doubt I am just paranoid, one whose limited mind has become unhinged attempting to understand the complexities of the issues at hand. You will forgive me my suspicions, I trust.
““That some of them may say they feel guilty is proof of nothing except maybe a susceptibility to hysteria. I don’t doubt they feel something, but guilt?”
You are dealing with my argument by ignoring it. Whether what Gilder (or young Germans) feel is properly described as guilt or not is exactly what I’m calling into question.”
I think I see your point now. What we have here is not guilt, but rather a feeling that is in some ways similar to guilt, yet at the same time it cannot be termed as true guilt, though of course simultaneously there are various guilt-like symptoms involved. Neither would it be properly called “Shame” or “Remorse”, which would also be imprecise terms. By gum, we have together discovered a new emotion that has hitherto been unidentified! I suggest we name this emotion “Extreme WASP Guilt-like Syndrome” or EWGLS. I shall write immediately to the American Psychology Association with the news, and never fear, you shall receive equal credit for its discovery. Good show, old boy, we are at the doorstep of world-wide fame!
PS. I now feel so silly for agreeing with Dr. MacDonald that this was guilt. What are his supposed credentials regarding psychology anyway? Ha!
Andrew says:
My dear sir, I apologize for the misunderstanding, which is my fault entirely.
Exactly. I’m not responsible for your absurd and probably intentional misunderstandings of what I’ve said, in this thread and elsewhere.
P.S. Welcome to my fan club! After such a stirring essay, you have my full support to run for president of that prestigious organization, currently headed up by a certain cartoon character. Best wishes for your campaign and let me know how it goes, won’t you?
Cheerio, old chap!
“By gum, we have together discovered a new emotion that has hitherto been unidentified! ‘Extreme WASP Guilt-like Syndrome’ or EWGLS.”
Andrew,
There’s already something called Identity-Alienation which refers to this emotion as expressed across groups.
“Self-Identity Alienation” would be a far better name for what Adam was talking about than EWGLGS.
@Adam,
Reading your latest post, I once again seem to see a pattern. Either you are a sincere person afflicted with silliness or you are actually insincere, a forum saboteur. You are obviously widely-read and well-educated, so the latter hypothesis would seem more likely. Consider:
“Some of these abolitionists exceeded even the Jews in their fanatic efforts to encourage race mixing.”
You give one quote from some nut in favor of miscegenation, then assume this desire was widespread among Whites in previous eras. Absolute rubbish. It was extremely uncommon (aside from Master/Slave relations few would admit to) and seen as an abomination by the vast majority, akin to beastiality. Mixed marriages were almost universally condemned and illegal in many states.
“Perhaps they can be forgiven, if only a bit, because at the time they lived they didn’t yet have the advantage of the insights of Charles Darwin, or any understanding of genetics. But this shows that white men of this stripe are entirely capable of causing their own genocide, without any help from Jews. Like American whites in general, they rip into their own with glee, and seem positively to relish the prospect of their own racial extinction.”
Your previous unrepresentational odd-ball quote is now “evidence” for your first major point: Whites are primarily responsible for their own demise. Really?
“Stoddard is an interesting case, too, because although he appears to understand that the Jews are non-white … and he fears Bolshevism, and he even makes the connection between Jews and Bolshevism, he’s not particularly anti-semitic. He barely mentions Jews in either The Rising Tide of Color or The Revolt Against Civilization.”
In Stoddard’s era, the Jews had not yet metastasized to reach their full potential as a culture of critique.
“Ironically, this apostle of racial loyalty even stabbed the Nazis in the back.”
You seem to equate White Nationalists with Nazis, so those at this blog will be disgusted with Stoddard for his “betrayal”. You don’t seem to realize that most WNs want nothing to do with National Socialism or Hitler, they just want their own ethnostate for their own kind, without harming or suppressing anyone.
“Stoddard was learned in many ways, and prophetic in others, but he had a lot of blind spots. When you take into consideration the state of science in his day, the blind spots are perhaps excusable. However, his soft-pedaling of the Jewish connection and apparent distaste for German oppostion to Jewry is especially curious. He appears to have been a very confused man.”
This appears to be the second main conclusion of your post: the great Lothrop Stoddard, a farseeing prophet that foretold much of Whites’ current predicament, who helped to galvanize the nation against non-White immigration, was actually (if we are to believe you), a second-rate, confused race-traitor.
“the WASP elites who ended up passing the 1924 immigration cutoff did it more from a sense of protecting their own elite status than any sense of white racial solidarity or anti-semitism, a solidarity and an anti-semtism which many of them were at pains to deny.”
This is an extension of your previous post where you argued that Whites have never had any sense of racial solidarity in the past. Of course my previous quote from Lothrop Stoddard that affirms the strong sense of racial identity Whites used to have is again ignored (one notable source among many, though I don’t want to belabor that issue now). You go on to say all kinds of “pro-White” things, then we reach your third main point:
“It’s very clear that if the Harvard of today were somehow to be obliterated from the face of the earth, and the entire student body, alumni, and faculty tossed into the deepest, blackest imaginable oubliette forever, it would be nothing but a great benefit and cause for celebration for the entire white race.”
We should eliminate the most prestigious university in the nation with all its faculty and students. After all, since Harvard produced a number of bad people, it must be Harvard’s fault. By logical extension, one could imply since all of the other elite universities are the same way, they all have to go too. Lets go get the torches!
So, we should now accept that Whites have always loved miscegenation, never had racial solidarity, they are primarily responsible for their plight, Lothrop Stoddard was a kook, and we would all be better off without elite institutions of higher learning. Of course, these gems of wisdom are wrapped in a layer of “pro-White” sentiment, like rich red meat wrapping up the broken glass. Am I crazy or does this have a whiff of sabotage about it?
Andrew says:
Of course my previous quote from Lothrop Stoddard that affirms the strong sense of racial identity Whites used to have is again ignored …
You mean the post where you gave us such sparkling pearls of your idiocy as:
You mean the ones where they deny they even have any racial solidarity? Racial solidarity should be made of sterner stuff.
I asked for an example of when whites had ever been united as a race, in support of the idea that there is such a thing as an inborn white racial cohesion. No one, including you, was able to give one. I also cited numerous instances, such as the Civil War and WWII, that demonstrated a conspicuous and chronic LACK of white racial cohesion. Now you are trying to dismiss all evidence against this assumption of yours that there is such a thing as a biologically-based white ethnocentrism by airily saying it “means little”. Look, this is just fatuous. It’s childish and unscientific, because you are trying to prove white racial solidarity exists by assuming it exists. Also, one must wonder, if you don’t accept the numerous examples I gave of whites actually showing a chronic LACK of racial cohesion as evidence it doesn’t exist, what evidence WOULD you accept? For if your assumption that a biologically-based ethnocentrism exists in whites cannot be disproved by means of any evidence, then it is not a scientific concept, but rather an article of faith.
This just denies the evidence. If it were all that rare the average US negro wouldn’t be 20% white by genetics, with that percentage increasing fast. Also, according to the statistics Reginald provided, 21% of white women now have sexually defiled themselves with a negro. And these are just the ones who ADMIT it! You’d have to be crazy to see this as a sign of hope.
I doubt you read the whole chapter that the Stoddard quote was drawn from.
Stoddard follows this dubious (yes, very dubious!) claim with a lengthy disquisition detailing all of the internecine warfare between whites, showing with great eloquence the thousand and one ways that various groups of whites betrayed other groups of whites, and lays particular stress on instances in which whites made alliances with non-whites in order to crush other whites. Some “instinctive comity”! And so much for “the greatest constant of all history!” As far as I could see he was unable to provide a single significant instance of it, although he does provide many, many examples of its LACK.
A little farther down in chapter 9, he writes, intriguingly:
But if the racial solidarity of the Germans was specious, just “using pseudo-racial arguments as camouflage for essentially political ends”, how are we ever to tell the genuine article from its counterfeit? How do we know, for example, that the Confederate elites weren’t simply “using pseudo-racial arguments as camouflage for essentially political ends”? Or how do we know the Nazis weren’t, as Stoddard appears to have later assumed? The answer is that without a better standard than merely relying on what people say their motives are, we can’t. For all we know, all professed racial solidarity on the part of whites could be fake. It could all be cultural in origin, without a biological basis. We must find a way to distinguish between fake, culturally imposed racial solidarity and the genuine article, rooted in the biology of race.
If a biologically-based racial solidarity exists among human beings at all, surely it is the Jews who provide the gold standard. Where one hesitates to speak of whites as a cohesive group at all, Jews are so united on questions that touch their race that they often seem to be a super-organism. While many, many examples of white racial perfidy to other whites can be found, such things are rare among Jews. Mordechai Vanunu, Israel Shamir, Benjamin Friedman, maybe Noam Chomsky, Paul Gottfried, perhaps a few more — traitors to Jewry can practically be counted on just the ten fingers.
I will stop at this point to allow you to respond using your usual ad hominems, smears, misconstructions, strawmen, etc., as befits the future president of my fan club.
Onward! Tally ho, old bean!
@Adam
There is an undeniable feral cunning in your arguments; well done, oh rancorous one!
“You mean the ones where they deny they even have any racial solidarity? Racial solidarity should be made of sterner stuff.”
You apparently believe that the US has always been a multicultural heaven, and Whites were on the whole colorblind. This position is so inane that I am at loss to know where to begin with your re-education. I realize that you were taught this during your university studies, but I urge you to be a little more open-minded. Look at the history of the US, with its race-based struggles with the Indians, race-based slavery, race-based immigration laws, race-based segregation, etc. How could there not be racial consciousness? I can point to the founding fathers, their slave-owning and many quotes about the perceived superiority of Whites. Its in Jefferson’s writings, Andrew Jackson had all kinds of choice things to say on the subject. The idea of Manifest Destiny, leading up to the war against Mexico, was closely associated with a belief that God had ordained that Whites were to rule the continent from coast to coast. Lets consult Abraham Lincoln:
“I have no purpose to introduce political and social equality between the white and the black races. There is a physical difference between the two, which, in my judgment, will probably forever forbid their living together upon the footing of perfect equality, and inasmuch as it becomes a necessity that there must be a difference, I, as well as Judge Douglas, am in favor of the race to which I belong having the superior position.”
He also referred to Mexicans as “mongrels”. Were his views unusual for the time or until the modern period? Hardly. Moving forward in time, imagine yourself in the US of 1950. By that year, every president, and just about every congressman and high-level figure in US history had been a White man. The nation was 90% European, many lived in small towns, and most minorities lived in segregated neighborhoods far from where Whites lived. Most people had probably never seen a Black, Asian or Mexican person in real life. Most of the images and exposure that Whites had of non-Whites came from pictures of them in the National Geographic or other magazines, showing them in their native third-world habitats. The “Japs” had been feared and hated during the recent war, interned in camps. Most blacks lived in the Jim Crow south. Racial awareness was a given. The word “nigger” was common, as were black-faced minstrels and jokes. Here is a quote from Harry Truman, the president:
“I think one man is just as good as another so long as he’s not a n*gger or a Chinaman. Uncle Will says that the Lord made a White man from dust, a nigger from mud, then He threw up what was left and it came down a Chinaman. He does hate Chinese and Japs. So do I. It is race prejudice, I guess. But I am strongly of the opinion Negroes ought to be in Africa, Yellow men in Asia and White men in Europe and America.”
I could go on and on with this, but I fear it would just fall on deaf ears, and I will be wasting my valuable time. So lets just agree to disagree. You can continue to disbelieve in there ever being any sense of racial solidarity amongst Whites.
“I also cited numerous instances, such as the Civil War and WWII, that demonstrated a conspicuous and chronic LACK of white racial cohesion.”
I see. Civil wars and wars against co-ethnics is proof of a lack of race consciousness. Therefore, Japanese have no race consciousness, because we know they had many bloody civil wars in the past. Arabs have no race consciousness, because they fight against each other all the time. Jews also have no race consciousness, because they warred amongst each other a great deal in the biblical era. I guess you have made your case, race consciousness does not exist. Bravo!
“Now you are trying to dismiss all evidence against this assumption of yours that there is such a thing as a biologically-based white ethnocentrism by airily saying it “means little”. Look, this is just fatuous. It’s childish and unscientific, because you are trying to prove white racial solidarity exists by assuming it exists.”
Once again, you have single-handedly disproved one of Dr. MacDonald’s central theses. I am stunned at your academic brilliance; good show! A quote from Dr. MacDonald:
“the implicit brain includes mechanisms related to ethnocentrism. There are several different evolved mechanisms that make us prefer people like ourselves and be wary of people in outgroups. Phil Rushton’s Genetic Similarity Theory [PDF] is a good example. Birds of a feather do indeed flock together. People tend to make friends and marry people who are like themselves on a wide range of traits, from IQ and personality, to ethnic group and even wrist size…White flight is one of the most salient phenomena of the late 20th century. And where are these white people fleeing to? To the suburbs where there are lots of other white people and where their children go to schools with other white children…they are “voting with their feet” by choosing friends and companions of the same race.”
http://www.vdare.com/macdonald/081125_ethnocentrism.htm
He goes on to mention some brain studies which support the idea. Its actually something commonly accepted in Evolutionary Biology circles, although I fully expect that you will soon publish a paper disproving all of that.
“This just denies the evidence. If it were all that rare the average US negro wouldn’t be 20% white by genetics, with that percentage increasing fast.”
I see that in your mind, blacks and whites have been happily humping out in the open since our founding, engaging in marriage and generally living a delightful multicultural existence. Once again, your incisive powers of deduction have disproved my suggestion that the miscegenation happened at a rate of perhaps 1-2% per generation based on master/slave relationships with a cumulative affect adding up to the current admixture.
“Also, according to the statistics Reginald provided, 21% of white women now have sexually defiled themselves with a negro. And these are just the ones who ADMIT it! You’d have to be crazy to see this as a sign of hope.”
You appear to positively revel in Whites mating with Blacks, and trumpet it as more reasons to be a defeatist. Pardon me though if I seriously question these statistics, White females do not have legions of sexual partners on average. Perhaps you can present a reputable study to support your assertion (in which case your rejoicing would be well founded). At any rate, this “defiling” was certainly not common before the 1970s, and of course we are discussing racial solidarity in the past, not the present.
“Stoddard follows this dubious (yes, very dubious!) claim with a lengthy disquisition detailing all of the internecine warfare between whites, showing with great eloquence the thousand and one ways that various groups of whites betrayed other groups of whites, and lays particular stress on instances in which whites made alliances with non-whites in order to crush other whites.”
Again, your enthusiasm for the internecine conflicts of Whites is remarkable. But as you have already proven that race consciousness does not exist, we don’t need to go any further with this. Case closed. You even outdid yourself in your last post, decisively proving that Lothrop Stoddard was a second-rate, confused race-traitor. Thus, we need not study him anymore.
“Some “instinctive comity”! And so much for “the greatest constant of all history!”
You are wise beyond your years, old boy. A genius you are, truly a genius, and an asset to your race and civilization.
“If a biologically-based racial solidarity exists among human beings at all, surely it is the Jews who provide the gold standard. Where one hesitates to speak of whites as a cohesive group at all, Jews are so united on questions that touch their race that they often seem to be a super-organism.”
But, old bean, you have already shown conclusively that Jews don’t have any race consciousness either. I am confused. Yet I am confident that it must all make sense somehow, as you are one of the great minds of our age.
“While many, many examples of white racial perfidy to other whites can be found, such things are rare among Jews. Mordechai Vanunu, Israel Shamir, Benjamin Friedman, maybe Noam Chomsky, Paul Gottfried, perhaps a few more — traitors to Jewry can practically be counted on just the ten fingers.”
I can say for certain that your celebration of the solidarity of Jews is well-founded. Let us rejoice together, it is good news indeed. Hurrah! Mazel Tov!
“I will stop at this point to allow you to respond using your usual ad hominems, smears, misconstructions, strawmen, etc., as befits the future president of my fan club.”
I hope you wont stop, for every last word from your industrious mouth is the purest gold, forming a treasure trove of knowledge for myself and mankind.
“Onward! Tally ho, old bean!”
Forth for the quest of knowledge! Lead us onward, good sir, to new discoveries and mental deductions!
“Also, according to the statistics Reginald provided, 21% of white women now have sexually defiled themselves with a negro.
Black 8.2%
Brown 5.0%
Blond 3.9%
Red 3.9%”
Adam,
I’m pretty sure you’re misreading the statistics I provided.
The data was posted on the Race/History/Evolution Blog to show that Blonde and Redhead White Women are LESS likely to report having had a negro sexual partner.
If the percentages for each hair color were unnormed for the number of Women of those hair color in the sample, it wouldn’t have been used to support that claim.
Andrew:
“I think one man is just as good as another so long as he’s not a n*gger or a Chinaman. Uncle Will says that the Lord made a White man from dust, a nigger from mud, then He threw up what was left and it came down a Chinaman. He does hate Chinese and Japs. So do I. It is race prejudice, I guess. But I am strongly of the opinion Negroes ought to be in Africa, Yellow men in Asia and White men in Europe and America.”
That’s an interesting quotation. Would you be kind enough to provide me with the source?
Lucy Skipping said concerning Andrew’s post:
“That’s an interesting quotation. Would you be kind enough to provide me with the source?”
Lucy, he attributes the quote in the paragraph above it. It was Harry Truman.
Thanks, Mark, but I’m asking Andrew for authentification that Truman said it. Some documentary source or link. Otherwise how do I know Andrew isn’t making it up? I wouldn’t put it past him! :)
@ Adam
Hmmm. Harry Dexter White, from what I’ve been told he was a “shriner type” of good old boy, and his Jewishness was pretty thin stuff. This I got from an anti-semite who had researched White and his era. I’m trying to remember the name of post war monetary agreement that White setup that was soooo good for the US. Highly unlikely thing for a spy to do.
Right wing propaganda tends to be a blight, rather than a help.
Maybe the the reduction in ethnocentrism and the increase in guilt by the Puritans was a part of the same secular decline in violence by the process that Clarke talks about.
The WASPS are of high socio- economic status, it certainly seems to me that those from the upper middle class are less tough-minded than the average person . I expected their greater education means they are exposed to more indoctrination, all the same they seem to have an inherently tender-minded attitude to ethnic defense of their own kind. It could be that extreme law abidingness brings a strain of cowardice with it.
How in the world could you possibly interpret those statistics that way? What it said was that of the white females in that survey sample, 8.2% of those with black hair, 5.0% of those with brown hair, 3.9% of those with blond hair, and 3.9% of those with red hair reported having had a black sex partner.
If someone said, “percent of white females in this sample who report having children, by hair color: black 65%, brown 70%, blond 75%, red 75%,” would you interpret that as meaning 285% of white women in the sample reported having children?
If you make such an error when it comes to basic interpretation of statistics, I very much doubt your other analysis and opinions can be trusted in the slightest.
Why are you so gleeful when you talk about miscegenation?
Lothrop Stoddard, The Revolt Against Civilization: The Menace of the Under Man, pp. 151-152
Lothrop Stoddard, The Rising Tide of Color Against White World-Supremacy, pp. 164-165
Where was “white guilt” 100 years ago? Nowhere near where it is today.
Did the people who tamed the West suffer from it? I seriously doubt so. What has happened in the meantime, of course, is the immigration of millions of eastern european jews, the “cultural revolution” of the ’60s, the influx of mass-scale third world immigration after 1965 and the ascendance of jews to an elite status of economic, political, cultural prominence.
WASPs have been outplayed in all these sectors. So, obviously the rules of the game have been reversed. If one wants to pursue a fruitful career they have to pander to the likings and manners of the new elite. Why this simple explanation usually escapes notice and all we’re left with are some dubious psycho-analytic claims about some peculiar supposedly “suicidal” strains in puritan/white character?
MGLS says:
[Stoddard quotes about Jews]
Yes, and those are about the only places that he mentions Jews in either book. Again, although he was against Bolshevism, Stoddard was not particularly anti-semitic, and the fact that he failed to see the Nazi opposition to Jewry in racial terms is very curious. Since Stoddard personally was involved with the Congressional hearings leading up to the 1924 immigration cutoff, that tends to confirm my suspicion that the cutoff was aimed at least as much at the prevention of the spread of Bolshevism as it was the prevention of the immigration of non-whites — perhaps moreso, given the public disavowals of racist or anti-semitic intent by the legislators cited in CoC. Stoddard appears to have been among those upper-crust whites of his day who were increasingly beginning to look on anti-semitism as something déclassé.
[pointing out my statistical error]
You and Reginald are right about the error, but on the overall point regarding the prevalence of interracial sex among white women, I think I’ll stand firm. If even as few as 5.25% of white women in this survey are willing to admit having had sex with a negro, you can be sure that the real figure for the percent of them who have had interracial sex is much higher, especially when we add in Mexicans, Jews, Asians, and all the assorted varieties of mystery meat now present in American society. 21% is probably on the low end of the possible numbers for the percentage of white women who have already been sexually defiled by a non-white.
Also, according to census bureau statistics, about 5.4% of marriages are now interracial — and this figure does not include the numerous white/hispanic interracial marriages, Jew/white interracial marriages. I would think we could add about another 2% or so to the 4.9% figure to take that into account (I’m being conservative here). So if ~7% or so of marriages are interracial, it seems likely (to me at least) that several times the amount of white women that have married a non-white have had sex with one and did not marry them. And once again, I will note that negroes in particular don’t tend to marry the white women they soil.
@Lucy,
You are well-advised to be cautious about quotes, for I believe there is base skulduggery afoot in this forum. Perhaps I am becoming unbalanced, but for some reason I sense a certain sleezy Semitic shyster – the poster Adam – is reading this even now!
This quotation from our president, “Give ‘em Hell Harry” Truman, can be found at:
http://www.discussanything.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-35610.html
There are many other interesting politically incorrect quotes from Harry here as well (and the source).
In future though, when checking on a quote, you can just type in some of the words and google it. Please forgive any unpleasantness in the discussion, its unfortunate that a certain individual must resort to unmanly mendacity rather than simply giving his opinion on matters. I am sure that OO would not censor a Jewish individual from chiming in and debating in a forthright manner.
Someday says:
THUS, within the borders of Statist societies, survival and reproduction came to depend on one’s willingness to comply with the State, including its monopoly on the use of violence. Successful individuals were now those who had a higher threshold for expression of violent behavior, especially when acting on their own initiative. They also tended to be individuals whose relative inhibition of violence could be released only by the voice of authority.
Maybe the the reduction in ethnocentrism and the increase in guilt by the Puritans was a part of the same secular decline in violence by the process that Clarke talks about.
Yes, this growth the state occurs pari passu with and is necessitated by the growth of the global technological system. It’s a facet of what I’ve been trying to convey here. A form of government and its bureaucratic apparatus like the America of 1776 isn’t compatible with the vastly improved techniques of global technological system in a host of ways, so it had to grow as the system grew. As I’ve before said, the global technological system has become the new nature, and the nature which formed the races by its selection pressures is in the process of being superseded. Without those pressures, and with a uniform technological environment for all, it’s clear the distinctions of race will ultimately vanish.
Thanks for the links.
kirk says:
Where was “white guilt” 100 years ago? Nowhere near where it is today.
Did the people who tamed the West suffer from it? I seriously doubt so.
What has happened in the meantime, of course, is the immigration of millions of eastern european jews, the “cultural revolution” of the ’60s, the influx of mass-scale third world immigration after 1965 and the ascendance of jews to an elite status of economic, political, cultural prominence.
WASPs have been outplayed in all these sectors. So, obviously the rules of the game have been reversed. If one wants to pursue a fruitful career they have to pander to the likings and manners of the new elite. Why this simple explanation usually escapes notice and all we’re left with are some dubious psycho-analytic claims about some peculiar supposedly “suicidal” strains in puritan/white character?
This is a good point. A rational calculation of self-interest, along with the conformism to group norms that is typical of most whites, explains it all. The neurosis of “white guilt” is just a pretext, a canard, a way that they can pretend to be more moral than they actually are.
Theories of Race and Racism: A Reader, p. 246
Andrew is campaigning feverishly to be elected the president of my fan club. In his zeal to obtain that lofty position, he’s taken to quoting Lincoln and Truman to prove that whites in America have all along had a tremendous racial solidarity. Who knew?!? There’s only one problem: Their actions spoke much louder than their words. Together they probably did more to destroy white racial solidarity than any other two Presidents, the one by launching the enormously bloody Civil War to abolish slavery and put negroes on equal legal footing with whites, and the other by both presiding over the rape of a prostrate Germany at the end of WWII, and by ending segregation in the US military, setting the stage for it to become the showpiece of multiracial egalitarianism and miscegenation that it is today.
Intelligence, of course, is not a requirement to join my fan club, let alone to become its president. It’s actually a disability, so Andrew is well qualified.
Good show, old sport! Huzzah!
Adam,
You neglecting to consider a highly relevant development.
The best evidence is that higher than average levels of Cosmopolitanism are being selected against on a Genetic Level, at least in the United States:
http://statsaholic.blogspot.com/2010/01/white-ethnocentrism-and-white-fertility.html
Also I find it very hard to believe that a genetic propensity for extra-legal violence is currently being selected against, when you consider that the people least likely to commit extra-legal violence are the very economic elites who have the lowest fertility rates.
Also, looking at State level data the Total Crime Rate of a State in 2007 has only an infinitesimal negative correlation with the Total Fertility Rate of that State in 2004:
http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0004912.html
http://old.swivel.com/data_sets/show/1005715
Crime Type R²
Violent Crime = -.0011
Murder = -.024
Forcible Rape = +.1505
Robbery = +.0087
Property Crime = +.1263
Interesting that the only crime directly having to do with sex had the most positive correlation with fertility across States.
I really haven’t figured out what’s causing this at this point, but the interconnected nature of the relationship between sex and fertility must have something to do with it (I really have to adjust for the Racial Composition of the States to see it’s just caused by a more rape oriented race having a higher fertility rate).
In any event, I can see no hard evidence that old fashioned traits like Ethnocentrism and the propensity to use non-state sanctioned violence are being selected against AT ALL by Natural or Sexual Selection.
Perhaps from 1500 to 1900 they were, though, as back then the law abiding upper classes had much higher fertility than they have now.
Also, Cosmopolitan social attitudes at that time were much less likely to be maladaptively extreme in their nature than they are now.
After all, how many even of the Abolitionists foreswore having children of their own to raise Darkie orphans from Haiti instead? How many of them actively taught their small children how wonderful it would be if they grew up to be Faggots and Lesbos? How many of them told their daughters that they could screw around all they wanted before marriage so long as they stuff their cervixes with enough baby be gone?
And yet even those behaviors, which are freakishly maladaptive on an individual level, find a significant degree of expression today in the most Anti-White quarters of the White Race.
“This is a good point. A rational calculation of self-interest, along with the conformism to group norms that is typical of most whites, explains it all. The neurosis of “white guilt” is just a pretext, a canard, a way that they can pretend to be more moral than they actually are.”
***********************************
Adam, I 100% agree.
Adam appears to be up to his old tricks once again.
“You and Reginald are right about the error, but on the overall point regarding the prevalence of interracial sex among white women, I think I’ll stand firm.”
You twist the facts just a teensy tad to suit your suggestion, in an almost Semitic manner, and stand firm with your unlikely assertion, in spite of apparently being unable to find data to support it. Why am I not surprised?
“21% is probably on the low end of the possible numbers for the percentage of white women who have already been sexually defiled by a non-white.”
Adam’s tone is interesting, he glibly and cheerfully crows about the “defilement” of European-American women. I tend to believe that a big part of his rather unusual methods of number-crunching stems from his optimistic hope that the phenomenon is common. His previous posts urging miscegenation for the health of the White gene pool are also noteworthy in this context.
The desire of Jewry for the “defilement” of White women is a subject of much discussion in WN circles. Jewish media has produced quite a collection of race-mixing entertainment, such as the film, “Whose Coming to Dinner”. Anne Liebowitz’s famous photograph of “African Warrior Dominating Blonde Germanic Damsel” (http://watchingthewatchers.org/news/1378/annie-leibovitz-monkeys-around-lebron) is another telling example of how Semites encourage and exult in Blacks men mating with White women.
And nothing is quite as maddening for the White Nationalist, which is perhaps why Adam baits us with it in several posts now (four already?) This illustrates an important aspect of the Semitic mind. For the Jew, the once world-conquering Aryan lion is held responsible for all of the Jewish pain and suffering for a thousand and a thousand years. The Semite remembers all, never forgetting or forgiving, with a hatred like fire unquenchable. And now, after a century of struggle, the great beast finally lies chained and fettered at the Jew’s feet. The leering Semite now baits the creature, forcing the Lion to watch as its tawny-maned mate writhes in the lecherous clutches of the Jew’s pet, a monstrous dark-faced brute. And the Jew gloats, dark eyes aglitter, luxuriating in his sworn enemy’s impotent rage. Adam clearly enjoys rubbing salt deeply into the wound.
Fortunately, the problem of mixed-race dating and marriage is a fairly small one. Whites have a large population, and can well afford to lose several million kinfolk to racial intermixing without much damage to the overall gene pool. From what we know of assortive mating, people are attracted to those of similar IQ. Those that are having children with Africans and Mestizos are probably on the lower end of the bell curve, the least intelligent Whites, the “trailer trash” so to speak. The central core of the European people, especially its greatest treasure, the flower of its womanhood, is secure. Whites are gradually departing from California, New York and other minority-held areas, and relocating to European strongholds in the Midwest, where fortunately, inter-racial marriage and miscegenation is as rare as an honest Jew. The White ethnostate is gradually coalescing.
Tom Watson says:
@ Adam
Hmmm. Harry Dexter White, from what I’ve been told he was a “shriner type” of good old boy, and his Jewishness was pretty thin stuff. This I got from an anti-semite who had researched White and his era. I’m trying to remember the name of post war monetary agreement that White setup that was soooo good for the US. Highly unlikely thing for a spy to do.
Right wing propaganda tends to be a blight, rather than a help.
White’s work as a Soviet spy has been well documented.
From wiki:
Also here:
Reginald says:
In any event, I can see no hard evidence that old fashioned traits like Ethnocentrism and the propensity to use non-state sanctioned violence are being selected against AT ALL by Natural or Sexual Selection.
I think Clark’s argument in its most basic form is that the monopoly on violence effected by the technology of a strong centralized state inevitably has an effect on the genetics of the underlying population. This way of thinking ties in with my own pretty well. To confirm, just look at the levels of violence in third world countries, where the technology of government is weak to non-existent, and compare their fertility rates to those of white countries today, which have substantially less fertility, and in fact in most cases are even below replacement level. Expressed in terms of r/K selection theory, he would argue that as the technological state monopolizes violence, the underlying population moves from being r selected (unstable environment; many offspring with low parental investment) to K selected (stable environment; few offspring with high parental investment).
Here’s an interesting exposition of Clark’s idea at the link Someday gave.
I had previously commented, re Andrew’s campaign for the presidency of my fan club:
I will stop at this point to allow you to respond using your usual ad hominems, smears, misconstructions, strawmen, etc., as befits the future president of my fan club.
It occurs to me now that I forgot to mention outright lies, which should be first in that list.
His previous posts urging miscegenation for the health of the White gene pool are also noteworthy in this context.
Where have I urged miscegenation, pray tell? Quote me, liar.
I find myself baffled by all this theoretical erudition and – positively Talmudic – disputation. Are you all trying to out-Jew the Jews? It can’t be done. Still, you might as well get your facts straight: First, Whites don’t do “guilt”…that’s an internalized Jew-thing, their overwheening “conscience”, and a mighty convenient thing it is: do vast evils, console oneself by feeling bad-before-oneself about it, then do it again, and again; Whites do (externalized) shame-before-the-other, which is disaterous and debilitating, when the ultimate Other happens to be,,,the Eternal Jew. Jews, on the other hand, are completely without shame: cf. their endless Wall Street machinations, predominance in porn, etc. etc. One more fact. Red Spy Harry Dexter White is claimed as a Jew by the Jews themselves: Martin Greenberg, THE JEWISH LISTS (NY, 1979), p. 96.
@Adam,
“Where have I urged miscegenation, pray tell? Quote me”
Oho! A short memory, have we? (wink, wink, nudge, nudge). You sly rascal you! Never fear though, you have asked for my assistance once again, and I am assuredly at your service. Lets see now, allow me to check the records, one minute please…Ah yes, here we are. In December, you were a poster named, “Progress”. You soon gave yourself a less socialist-sounding name, “Adam” (much like Lev Bronstein renamed himself to Leon Trotsky, to better mix among the goy). You begin by boldly stating your cultural Marxist beliefs, suggesting the usual line, “there is no such thing as race”. You go on about how miscegenation is not only to be expected, but that it’s actually a wonderful thing, producing “hybrid vigor” and so forth.
http://theoccidentalobserver.net/tooblog/?p=304&cpage=1#comments
Of course, you are welcome to your opinion, all views are appreciated. Thats not the problem, old boy. You can say anything you like, no one faults you for that. The issue at hand is your mendacity, your deception, whether you are a devious troll. Is is not rather odd that the multicultural Marxist transforms into the White Nationalist in a mere month? Most remarkable, Id say! Perhaps you were visited by an angel, one of Wagner’s valkries maybe, and as you were bathed in light, you were ideologically reborn. But one has to wonder; is this a conversion, or a chameleon? Mere weeks ago, thou wert a champion of human rights, righteously accusing CaptainChaos of anti-Semitism:
“This whole line of argument is a little surprising coming from an anti-semite of the hysterical kind like the Admiral here. After all, don’t such anti-semites usually like to rant about Jewish “gene stealing”?” (same link as above)
Are not such charges of anti-Semitism are a a trademark calling card of Jewry? Yet some few weeks later, a brand new, changed Adam miraculously emerges from his cocoon:
“Our house is indeed a decayed house, infested with Jew rats spawned in the sewers of Europe, and they now own it.” (your comments for the current article)
Tell me, Adam, what was it that caused your sudden transformation from high-minded, philo-Semitic philosopher into an anti-Semitic Aryan warrior? And why does virtually every comment you write contain poisonous seeds of despair and defeatism? And why the continuous cultural critique against the great men of the West, such as Lothrop Stoddard? And why the stream of silly suggestions such as needing to dismantle all technology and universities for White Nationalism to have any chance of success? I look forward to your response with anticipation. Being a most creative fellow, you will no doubt have a perfectly innocent explanation.
Yet you also will, I trust, forgive me if my suspicions persist. For I name you, sir, here and now, a dastard, an agent of surreptitous subterfuge! Shame! Shame upon you sir. Your bald-faced crimes lie nakedly exposed before the eyes of all, and the shameful sight is butt-ugly! You slithered in like a slimy Semitic serpent, sneaking stealthily into the hallowed halls of the web-magazine of Dr. Kevin MacDonald himself. And I say treachery! Fear! Fire! Foes!
Oh yes, you began your career innocently enough. Entering in boldly with your “progressive” name, thinking to overwhelm the foolish goyim with crafty words. Yet you found yourself pitted against unassailable ideas. Pummelled mercilessly with rational argument and reason, you met only defeat and humiliation. Yet what is a jew, if not cunning, and the artful serpent quickly changed its stripes. Renaming yourself, you then took the role of a black leech, worming your way into each discussion. Yes, you had much to say that people wanted to hear, and much else besides. For in almost every comment you left were the sly, dark whispers of defeatism, despair, nonsense and poison, the very substance which with the Jews pour continually into the veins of our culture.
And now, behold! The worm has at last been unveiled, betrayed by his own words. And to you, Adam, I say: “A witless worm have you become. Therefore be silent, and keep your forked tongue behind your teeth. I have not passed through fire and death to bandy crooked words with a serving-man till the lightning falls.” -Gandalf, LOTR
The fact that is in the US, 97% of whites marry other whites. That’s what galls the jews. The jews hate whites for many reasons, most of them borne out of jealousy. The tribe has actually just about reached its peak, the zenith of their power. Things will go a bit more their way, then it’s going to collapse. On a conscious level they can’t see this, could not possibly consider it. But on an unconscious level, they realize it and are in a panic. Hence the stepped up nonsensical posts and attacks on various WN sites, the useless attempts at aligning themselves with “hispanics” who will smile, take favors, then derive even greater joy from stabbing the Judios in the chest with a stiletto when the time comes. For all of the talk of jews having fun parading white women with non-whites in the media all day long, people should visit Southern California, places like Encino and Sherman Oaks which are heavily jewish. The jewish girls, while usually marrying jewish men when they grow up, seem to spend their teen years rutting mostly with blacks, mexicans and the wildest low class white boys. This isn’t arguable, and it’s something that troubles the jews greatly, but they can’t speak about it publicly. They claim white women WANT non-whites because it’s their own women who run with the lowest of the low. As in many areas, it’s the jews projecting their faults onto whites.
Andrew says:
@Adam,
“Where have I urged miscegenation, pray tell? Quote me”
Andrew, one of my biggest fans, is once again hard at work as my unpaid publicity team. He sums up at length, in loving detail, every twist and turn of my posting history on this blog, which he has been following from day one with the awestruck attention characteristic of a true fanboi. Then he says:
You go on about how miscegenation is not only to be expected, but that it’s actually a wonderful thing, producing “hybrid vigor” and so forth.
Note the “subtle” shift here. :-) Now the claim isn’t that I “urged” miscegenation, but that I say it’s “a wonderful thing”. Not only is this a brand new lie, but we can also see that this is what passes for cleverness in the mind of a simple “chap” like him. Amazing!
He then links to here wherein I wrote the following:
This is, of course, just proof that Andrew, desperate for me to pay attention to him, has sunk to the level of outright lies. Plainly, I am here only offering up a hypothesis that attempts to account for Ashkenazi differences from Middle Eastern Jews who did not sojourn in Europe, and who testing has shown have lower IQ. It does not say miscegenation is “a wonderful thing”, and it does not “urge” miscegenation on the part of whites, and in fact, if anything, it does the opposite. Under this theory, it was the white failure to prevent miscegenation that enabled Jews to enhance their IQ. But then, this is just what you’d expect of whites, who once again showed a conspicuous LACK of racial cohesion.
Andrew’s elevator may not quite make it all the way to the top, but clearly, he’s trying his hardest. I’m sure I speak for everyone when I say that I deeply appreciate him taking time to act as my one-man publicity crew. Like him, I believe that the ideas I’m putting forward here are important and unique, and deserve to be mulled over more than once.
Keep your shoes shined, old sod, and you may one day be president of my fan club after all!
“Under this theory, it was the white failure to prevent miscegenation that enabled Jews to enhance their IQ. But then, this is just what you’d expect of whites, who once again showed a conspicuous LACK of racial cohesion.”
Actually it was only enabled by the infinitesimal number of Whites who converted to Judaism each generation.
And per generation far more Jews converted to Christianity than Whites converted to Judaism.
Therefore, according to your standards, it was Jews who showed a conspicuous LACK of racial cohesion.
Adam,
How do you think that being part European and part Middle Eastern contributed to Ashkenazi Jews being more Ethnocentric?
Reginald says:
“Under this theory, it was the white failure to prevent miscegenation that enabled Jews to enhance their IQ. But then, this is just what you’d expect of whites, who once again showed a conspicuous LACK of racial cohesion.”
Actually it was only enabled by the infinitesimal number of Whites who converted to Judaism each generation.
That might be another possibility. But if it were true, one would expect the Jews to show a lot more diversity in mtDNA and on the Y chromosome than they do.
What I’m suggesting here is in the context of the paper by Need, et al., which showed that most Ashkenazi Jews were descended from just a few founding mothers of local, European stock.
And per generation far more Jews converted to Christianity than Whites converted to Judaism.
I’ve never seen any scholarly studies on this. If you’re referring to Roman times, I doubt that any reliable data is available. Do you have any? If so, what was the actual rate of sincere conversion? (I would count a Jew’s conversion as sincere only if the convert ceased to defend Jews or Jewish causes and outmarried into the Gentile world.)
Therefore, according to your standards, it was Jews who showed a conspicuous LACK of racial cohesion.
Hard to say without more. E.g., What time period are you talking about? What conversion rate for Gentiles -> Jews and the reverse? Which Gentiles? Which Jews? Where?
The question of when and exactly how the Jews became as ethnocentric as they are is an interesting one. In my view, they are the all-time champs for racial cohesion. Reading their history, one gets the impression they’ve just always been that way. Therefore, I’d be very surprised to see any reliable data that showed a high rate of sincere Jewish conversion in the historical periods for which we have good records. During the Spanish Inquisition, for example, the conversions were notoriously insincere.
Reginald says:
Adam,
How do you think that being part European and part Middle Eastern contributed to Ashkenazi Jews being more Ethnocentric?
It’s not clear to me that the Ashkenazi Jews are any more ethnocentric than any other Jews, if that’s what you mean. I find the converse hypothesis to be more interesting: That whites for a time picked up some biological ethnocentrism from Jews during the early Christian period, which perhaps was then bred out of them later by the marriage policies promoted by the Catholic Church, as detailed here by KM.
“What I’m suggesting here is in the context of the paper by Need, et al., which showed that most Ashkenazi Jews were descended from just a few founding mothers of local, European stock.”
I get it.
But as you say, it was just a few of us Whites who turned Jew.
“Hard to say without more. E.g., What time period are you talking about? What conversion rate for Gentiles -> Jews and the reverse? Which Gentiles? Which Jews? Where?”
I meant in total, since the Diaspora, in those areas where there were both a lot of Jews and White Christians.
“Therefore, I’d be very surprised to see any reliable data that showed a high rate of sincere Jewish conversion in the historical periods for which we have good records.”
There isn’t direct data.
However, there’s statistical evidence showing a strong 48% Correlation between a Roman City having a Synagogue around 100 and being one of those cities most receptive to Christianity (as measured by giving the city 2 points if it was known to have a Church by 100, and 1 point if it was known to have one by 200).
This is stronger even than the 35% correlation between receptivity to Christianity and having a active Gnostic groups, in spite of Gnosticism being an offshoot of Christianity!
It’s just too strong of a correlation between Synagogue and Church for it not to have been driven by Jews converting to early Christianity.
A lot of the converts were Hellenized Greeks who were caught between the Worlds of Judaism and Paganism, and were attracted to a religion that professed to be the culmination of Judaism, while speaking in Greek and incorporating elements of Platonic Philosophy.
“During the Spanish Inquisition, for example, the conversions were notoriously insincere.”
That’s certainly true, but that was after Jews had time to culturally and psychologically adapt to the destruction of the Temple.
Also it came after hundreds of years of Jew v. Christian conflict which had much more of an effect on the average Jew than the average Christian. (Those were the days!)
“It’s not clear to me that the Ashkenazi Jews are any more ethnocentric than any other Jews”
********************************
Adam,
Yeah I agree.
I was just responded to that old comment of yours where you seemed to draw a connection between Jewish “Hybrid Vigor” and Jewish Racial Cohesion.
Maybe you were just fooling around or something.
“That whites for a time picked up some biological ethnocentrism from Jews during the early Christian period, which perhaps was then bred out of them later by the marriage policies promoted by the Catholic Church, as detailed here by KM.”
************************************
Both more interesting and very credible.
The maddening thing about what the Catholic Church did with its damned marriage regulations is that there was no reason in Heaven or Earth to do it, save to sucker more old men into willing their money to the already rich Church, as opposed to giving it to their Kinsmen.
“For in almost every comment you left were the sly, dark whispers of defeatism, despair, nonsense and poison, the very substance which with the Jews pour continually into the veins of our culture.”
Yes, that’s the Cass Sunstein tactics at work. The future of trolling will be more along the lines of infiltration/agent provocateurs, rather than simple flaming.
“Intelligence, of course, is not a requirement to join my fan club, let alone to become its president. It’s actually a disability, so Andrew is well qualified.”
A person who believes that percentages are an additive measurement is in no position to insult the intelligence of others.
Andrew, this charlatan going by the name of Adam is playing games. He rambles about whites uniting as a race, trying to goad when in fact the whole of whites have never had to unify as a race per se, because no threat existed at any time as it does now. A threat controlled by the most hypocritical, racist, sadistic ethnic group to ever exist on this planet. What scares Adam and his ilk is the fact that whites have unified, in different regions, to fight off threats in the past. To fight wars against non-whites. To fight against Mohammedans who had the gates opened for them by the jews.
If the jews weren’t worried about losing control at some point, if they weren’t afraid of things slipping, then you wouldn’t have these clowns from Hillel House or the ADL putting in their mandated internet monitoring time. The jews know they have to parasitize us to keep themselves going, and that’s the main reason they hate us. I suppose they feel they can parasitize the Chinese or someone else if they achieved the jewish dream of extinguishing whites. But that won’t happen. Despite jews telling the Chinese and other non-whites behind closed doors that they themselves aren’t white and will help bring down the white man, the Chinese and other Asians look at the jews simply as sneaky whites or filthy arabs who simply call themselves jews and fight with their cousins. Just ask them. The latinos historically don’t trust the jews but will use them. Who cares what the blacks think? It’s going to all come to an end again, and it won’t be pretty. Jewish rule never lasts very long because of their innate blindness and arrogance in so many areas. They’re so busy worshipping themselves (after all, look at judaism, it’s self worship) that they never see most of their own shortcomings, even when they believe they do.
“with a uniform technological environment for all, it’s clear the distinctions of race will ultimately vanish”
Rub a White-created computer on the belly of a black man and it boom! Lead turns into brass!
@Adam
Gadzooks! Are you still here? When Gandalf banished wormtongue in the movie, he scuttled off. Im baffled. Maybe I didn’t intone the spell correctly, for it appears we arent rid of you yet. What do I have to do, call Orkin pest control to report a rat problem? If that fails, I may have to resort to finding an exorcist.
“Now the claim isn’t that I “urged” miscegenation, but…”
I think that part of our problem is that you are just misunderstood. We should all do our part to increase our understanding of each other, to make the world a better place. To help in this effort, I have purchased a book to help me. Lets see, here it is, “International Compendium of Internet Trolls, fifth edition”. Flipping through it, I see the entry, “Poison Dwarf Troll”. Ah, here we are. It says, “this type of troll often uses the “Red Herring” gambit, going on and on about an irrelevant topic, diverting the interlocutor from the main issue”. Aha! Now I understand you better, you rascal. Your little essay on how one is to interpret your remarks on miscegenation is a classic example of this gambit. Youre a crafty one, I’ll give you that!
“you may one day be president of my fan club after all”
I am a little hesitant to tell you this, but I actually wasn’t that impressed with your mental powers in my previous post, I was just being a little facetious. Now, now, please don’t feel badly; I wasn’t expecting you to take me seriously, just a bit of kidding. Oh boy, now I see Im in a quandry, you really are convinced of your greatness. You have mentioned your fan club something like 6 times now in the past week, but really, old bean, its not good form to beg. Please understand, this beseeching is all a bit uncomfortable for me. I will tell you what, since you are having trouble finding members for your fan club, I will see if my dog would like to join. I have printed out what I expect is a reasonable likeness of you here:
http://www.jrbooksonline.com/jew-bwa-ha-ha.gif
Next, I shall attempt to pin it on Hermann. Come here boy! Hmmm, Im having a little difficulty attaching it to his collar, he seems to be instinctively revolted at the sight of a Jewish troll. Oh dear, now he has gone and has torn it off and unceremoniously urinated upon it. Bad dog! Sorry about that, this is quite embarrassing. I do have a friend who has a pet snake, perhaps that creature would consent to membership in your club. If not, perhaps a sewer rat could be found that is less particular, and might join. Never fear, we shall think of something, don’t let this get you down, all will be well. Keep a stiff upper lip, I always say!
Whites should finally give up the United States and form their own ethnic states in areas such as Vermont and New Hampshire…
There is no way we could take back the whole US.