Heavy metal music has been strongly associated with devil-worship and a fetish for all things ‘evil’, but since the 1990s a new current has risen from the North. Scandinavia, particularly Norway, is the cradle of the most extreme form of metal called Black Metal. Black Metal in turn has given birth to the phenomenon of Viking metal. This moniker is not only a testament to its Scandinavian roots but also for its overtly Germanic themes.
The first band to herald the age of Viking metal was the Swedish band Bathory (1983–2004) with its release of the album Hammerheart in 1990. It was musically a departure from the raw Thrash metal and adopted a more epic/atmospheric sound. The lyrics (in English) were about Vikings and Nordic mythology. The following video, ”One Rode to Asa Bay,” has nearly 2.4 million views on You Tube.
httpv://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hDpc-831GPs&feature=related
In the mid 1990s a new generation of Viking metal emerged with the pioneering Norwegian band Enslaved (1991–present). Enslaved is undoubtedly rooted in Norwegian Black Metal, which forms the basis of its sound/vocals. It was nevertheless a Viking Metal band from the very beginning—adopting Nordic mythology in the lyrics and even singing in Old Norse. The album Frost (1994) heralded their breakthrough in the Metal scene with the song Frost/Loke as its blasting introduction. Another more recent song which includes folk instruments and vocals is Sigmundskvadet from the album Monumension (2001).
During the time Enslaved was coming of age Satyr, the leader of the Norwegian Black Metal band Satyricon, began an interesting but temporary side-project called Storm (1993–1995). Satyr reshaped Norwegian folksongs in metal-style and compiled them into an album called Nordavind (1995) with Mellom bakkar og berg as its most resounding song. Storm caused some stir in leftist circles as being too nationalist because the Norwegian flag was printed on the CD and because of the nationalist salutations (‘Hill Nordmenner!’ [Hail Norsemen!]).
Varg Vikernes
While Storm was dancing on the edge of political correctness, Burzum (1991–1999, 2009–present), emerged as overtly racialist. Burzum is a one-man project of the Norwegian Varg Vikernes which began as a Black Metal artist and evolved into dark ambient music with lyrics referring to Nordic mythology. Vikernes resorted to church burnings as a revenge for the Christianization of Norway and was ultimately jailed for killing a leftist fellow Black Metaller. In prison he has continued preaching National-Socialism on his website Burzum.org.
Going back to Storm, we can conclude in hindsight that the mid 1990s was the starting point of Viking metal. It goes too far beyond this modest article to name and describe them all. The most important feature they have in common is that they make a distinct kind of music which is geographically confined to the Germanic world and which exalts Nordic history and culture.
Viking metal has also resulted in the production of very good video clips which makes the music more appealing. Týr (1998–present) from the Faroe Islands is a good example of a Viking metal band which adopts a mix of local folk songs, Nordic mythology and Viking scenes in videoclips, like Regin Smiður, Ormurin Langi (original folk song here) and Sinklars Visa. They record their Viking songs largely in their native tongue, probably the language closest to what Vikings spoke when they ruled the waves 1000 years ago.
In the 2000s Viking metal has also spread beyond Scandinavia into Germany, where Menhir (1995–present) is the best of its genre. Menhir has developed a more specific ‘South-Germanic’ brand of Viking metal with German history and lyrics. The band is not only a musical project but is also heavily involved in re-enactment of German history. Their latest album Hildebrandslied (2007) has also resulted in a videoclip of the main song Hildebrandslied, an ancient German heroic song which is sung in Old German, in which the band members appear as Germanic warriors depicting the saga of Hildebrand.
Although Viking metal is not a widespread phenomenon, it has proven its survival and vitality as a subculture within the wider heavy metal scene. This subculture is implicitly White; concerts are virtually all-White events and the themes are certainly not the sort of thing that would appeal to Muslims or Jews. (Incidentally, this deep national consciousness tapped into by Viking metal is more or less missing in America. This is the main reason why revolution is likely to begin in Europe.)
This kind of music has done more to advance the cause of Nordic awareness than all the books written about this topic. It values ancient songs and themes and at the same time can compete with shallow mainstream music, which is dominated by minorities. Although overtly political themes are lacking, Viking metal is a subculture which is creative and appealing to young people and raises the awareness of Nordic culture and history.
Facing the Future as a Minority
Was the Immigration Act of 1924 Illiberal?
Are there any girl Viking singers and musicians, or is it just a lads’ night out?
@Lancashire lad: It will undoubtedly take a stronger resurgence of Nationalism before the Girls/Women get on board. They, more than others have been conditioned to prefer “pop culture”. So, they may hang onto the music of the leftists, and negroes until this newer White Nationalist music takes root.
Another branch of extreme metal that have had a huge impact on the hearts and minds of the “Euro-tribes” is the Slavic pagan metal which often incorporates folk instruments, poems and songs creating implicit historical and mythological reawakening. Well worth checking out
Great article. I love reading the Heavy Metal culture. And you are right, Metal with Nordic or White history is missing here in the U.S., despite a lot of culture and history to draw upon.
Check out the European Metal channel on YouTube:
http://www.youtube.com/user/EuropeanMetalChannel#p/u
This is all well and good but has any European metal frontman given a speech like this?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cxQk3DC3gL0
fyi, this is Phil Anselmo of Pantera.
Does anybody know who is doing the background music of the Ulfhednar website linked to in the article? By the way, check out Heidevolk…
@fender: I’m sure his wife, Stephanie Weinstein, approved.
The problem with black metal as a vehicle for White interests is that, well, it’s basically just lame. All Vikings all the time gets boring real quick. There’s nothing in it to make it relevant to the lives of people living today.
Led Zeppelin sang about Vikings and incorporated northern European folk music into their work as early as 1970. The difference is that they did it in a way that was actually cool. Take a look at this concert video of “Immigrant Song”, and compare with the black metal stuff, and it’s easy to see why Led was “the biggest band in the world” with appeal to both sexes, and why metal is basically an all-male loser subculture:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RlNhD0oS5pk&ob=av3e
I have a hard time seeing black metal achieving any sort of mainstream popularity without a pretty radical makeover.
It’s not very accurate to say that mainstream music is “dominated by minorities”. Aside from metal, country and alternative rock are also nearly exclusively White. Also, as far as “minorities” in music are concerned, we are essentially talking about Blacks, as there are very few Hispanics, Asians, or Middle Easterners in any sort of popular music listened to by significant numbers of Whites, and even most of the non-Black minorities you do find there are doing their best to come across as White as possible.
The real battleground in popular music is the stuff that is played in clubs – the stuff that attractive young White women dance to. Taking and holding the dance floor is what really counts as far as music is concerned. I think there is sort of an implicit race war going on between the Black-dominated American hip hop and the Euro-style electronic dance music. There is also a strong retro 80′s synthpop trend, which harkens back to a time when America was much Whiter than it is today and is very implicitly White.
I actually think the Jews are having trouble maintaining the Black domination of popular music. The internet has freed up the distribution channels and weakened the grip of the Jewish A&R guys. “Gangsta” rap is pretty much dead, and has not been replaced by anything that is similarly off-limits to Whites. The extent to which Jews have been awkwardly promoting Black rappers in the preteen Justin Bieber, Rebecca Black, and Miley Cyrus stuff (“and the Jay-Z song was on…”) has the whiff of desperation about it to me. And increasingly the trend is for Blacks to be emulating White forms of music rather than the reverse. Pretty much everyone is doing electropop now. Look at the recent hit “Party Rock” by LMFAO, which features two mostly White mulattoes rapping over a Dutch house beat. I interpret this as a sign that the Blacks and their Jewish promoters are losing ground, if this is the best they can come up with:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KQ6zr6kCPj8
Anyway, the point is, anyone looking to promote White interests via music and have an impact on the mainstream would be best advised to put down the 7-string, 25-fret guitar and get a hold of Autotune and Ableton Live.
The problem with music like this is that it is not appealing to the masses because it doesn’t have the simple base sound of rap and mainstream pop that appeals to our loins. Females are not attracted to and aroused by this kind of music, it is as awkward as they claim white men are, no rhythm.
As someone who tends to listen to the types of music discussed and alluded to here, I began reading this article with much interest.
I was disappointed to see very little real discussion here of this kind of music, why it is being made, and what it actually symbolizes. While I agree with the last two paragraphs to a large extent, it’s not clear what, if any, deeper impact this type of music has beyond the level of entertainment. Nor am I truly sure how much deeper it permeates either the listener or the musician (or even Mr. Stuyvesant) beyond matters that ultimately boil down to convenience. Of course, these things can vary considerably across bands and listeners.
While I realize this should not be a name dropping contest, and I wouldn’t want it to be, I am baffled by the absence of discussion of bands such as Windir, Amon Amarth, Nokturnal Mortum, etc. from this article.
Enslaved has almost nothing to do with Viking metal anymore, and hasn’t for years, but you wouldn’t know that from what is written here.
Yes, Burzum made some ambient music, but it was because of Varg Vikernes’ circumstances at the time more than anything else. He has since released metal albums again, including “Belus” which was originally intended to be titled “The White God”. The story surrounding the last minute change of titles, let alone Varg and the various works and essays he has produced and written, is probably an article (or two) in itself.
…I am not mentioning these for the purpose of being contentious but rather, I think there is much to delve into with these bands, their motives, the changes they often go through over several releases, etc. Again, are the themes merely convenient, entertaining, fads, or are they truly deeper than that as alluded to here and is that deeper meaning fully understood by the bands and the listeners?
Like Oxy, I am familiar with Slavic pagan metal also, and I am familiar with a number of other bands and subgenres of metal which are similar to or are offshoots of black metal.
I have listened to and studied this type of music quite extensively, and I still have great trouble definitively answering some of these questions and in reconciling results, both intended and unintended, with actual intentions. And it does seem to vary from band to band.
I have to admit, I think it’s a little bit convenient to just take a casual look at this subgenre, see what one wants to see, and whip up a brief article praising it on somewhat dubious assumptions. I would love to see an in-depth thoughtful essay on this subject, and perhaps this can be a first step and inspire just that sort of thing.
@Athanasius:
Why wouldn’t she? He made it clear that the band was not racist, and saying that Whites should have pride is not the same as saying that they should hate other races.
The big trap that a lot of WN’s fall into- and the one that the White-haters *want* us to fall into- is the idea that loving our culture is synonymous with hating other cultures. That’s what they want everyone to think, and it’s typical leftist inversion, that love is hate, hate is love, etc.
The lyrics to Pantera’s Rise give a good summary of Anselmo’s message:
“Taught when we’re young to hate one another
It’s time to have a new reign of power
Make pride universal so no one gives in
Turn our backs on those who oppose
Then when confronted we ask them the question
What’s wrong with their mind?
What’s wrong with your mind?”
The message is that pride should be universal, that every race should love its own and not hate other races. And the question for those who fight against pride: what’s wrong with you?
This, to me, is the right perspective. Hatred is for the weak. There’s no reason why Whites should hate any other races, we’re simply too good for it. To me, a lot of WN’s hate blacks and Jews more than they like Whites.
The Tim Wises and Noel Ignatievs of the world: they’re the real haters, the peddlers of ressentiment, the levellers, the angry, feminine, phony whiners. The last thing Whites want to be is like them, bitching about everything and attacking everyone and everything.
Anselmo summed up the right approach in the video and the song. This is why I like Pantera so much: brutally honest lyrics in addition to great musicianship. It’s heavy and gloriously masculine, nothing childish and phony. It’s a shame what happened to their guitarist.
Mr. Stuyvesant, why on Earth you put up The Lake with its cheap, fan-made King Arthur video to showcase Bathory instead of the most excellent and only official video Quorthon ever made: One Rode to Asa Bay, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hDpc-831GPs&feature=related, only Odin knows.
And no Amon Amarth? Tsk! Best metal band of the last 20 years, hands down. All viking, all the time, absolutely epic. Hail!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3WJX1cIuY4
FMPOV it is not the Black Metal scene that is important per se, it is how it works as an avant guarde moving the boundaries for what is accepted to sing about, or what is accepted for people to listen too.
Same goes for viking metal, that will make others pick up medieval ballads, one example being “Sinklas vise” mentioned in the article.
One further example is the german band “in extremo”, that sings old european ballads in metal versions, that makes fans seek out the originals.
In Extremo – Herr Mannelig
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5c4MhVz4_Yo&feature=related
Original version by Swedish band Garmarna
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HB27Az3xIpU&feature=related
A spanish version by Haggard
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jH_jEj4x5_8&feature=related
Another song that “In extremo” singing it have sent listeners for the original.
Garmarna – Vänner och Fränder
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZdWpjHlXPo
Two more medieval ballads.
“Viking metal” version of Rolandskvadet
Glittertind: Rolandskvadet (With Lyrics)
Helene Bøksle: Heiemo og nykkjen (Anders Behring Breiviks favorite artist)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSEUcIBCbLA
Frankly, I think this stuff is shallow, childish nonsense. I am not saying that folk music can’t be stirring, but this isn’t folk music, this is just setting low expectations for our youth in how they dress, think and act. I expect more from highly intelligent peoples.
If you check into “Hildebrand”, you will find that the historical character he was based on, Theodoric was a philosemite. LOL.
Nice article, but your take on Varg Vikernes is a copy of the rather false image the media has projected of him. He was pretty much convicted by the media from the beginning. Perhaps that is not without reason, considering his position and influence in a pro-white subculture.
Actually I think this is degrading to norse culture – it turns into a shallow comic book of black clad angry ‘vikings’ – the only thing missing is the horned helmets.
THIS is folk:
http://30.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_liu2oxraMQ1qbs4u5o1_400.jpg
This ‘viking’ metal is shallow demoralizing nonsense. I don’t know why the TOO keeps pushing this trash.
Has the ‘rock and roll’ lifestyle EVER been anything but damaging? .
@me:
“Frankly, I think this stuff is shallow, childish nonsense.”
Wise people know that they should keep their mouths shut, when it comes to subjects they are ignorant about, and you my friend are ignorant, when it comes to Scandinavian folk music and Scandinavian mythology, a subject a lot of the black metal musicians often know a lot about.
Back to my previous post, the link to Rolandskvadet by Glittertind fell out.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v8XcyMITG1w&feature=related
Glittertinds version is based on the Norse version of La Chanson de Roland, where the melody also survived.
This is a more original version of the same song:
GNY – Rolandskvadet (2010) Danish
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9-3oarCCwdQ
From wikipedia:
The Song of Roland
The Song of Roland (French: La Chanson de Roland) is the oldest surviving major work of French literature. It exists in various different manuscript versions which testify to its enormous and enduring popularity in the 12th to 14th centuries. The oldest of these is the Oxford manuscript which contains a text of some 4004 lines (the number varies slightly in different modern editions) and is usually dated to the middle of the twelfth century (between 1140 and 1170). The epic poem is the first and most outstanding example of the chanson de geste, a literary form that flourished between the eleventh and fifteenth centuries and celebrated the legendary deeds of a hero.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Song_of_Roland
GNY also has a more original version of Sinklars vise that is repressented by TYR in the article.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sDhG5fvpXxg
Sure, Black Metal, Heavy Metal, and even Rock’n Roll may be considered childish nonsense, but surely some of the intellectual giants that lurk among these pages must realize you cannot get a cultural revolution off the ground without appealing to the young. Just ask the Frankfurt School. And if the youth of our race love Black Metal, with its explicit and implicit White themes, then I say headbang away.
“Wagner is the Father of Heavy Metal.” -Joey DeMaio, Manowar
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMQ6tAQ76vE&feature=related
@Matthias:
why does it appeal to our young? Because they are dumbed down and decadent. further dumbing them down
@Volksverhetzer: oh gosh! thanks, i NEVER heard of the Song of Roland before!
setting to black metal is like rock and roll versions of hymns and Christmas carols. its stupid, shallow garbage…
What next, ‘guitar solo’ heavy metal versions of Paganini? spare us, please.
subject matter doesn’t change the fact that this music is garbage. I can create a fantasy graphic novel of say, The Divine Comedy. Only an idiot would compare it with Dante.
Indeed some black metal is trite and childish, but to excuse the lot of it for the failure of some to make decent and interesting music with a message is even more trite and childish. The best part of this subgenre of music is how far outside of the echo chamber it exists. So some people here haven’t ever heard of Bathory before. Now that you’ve heard a bit you might be interested and you’ll head down the rabbit hole of Norse Metal and discover more all by yourself since there is no airplay or commercialism to guide your hand.
And yes, Varg is the man! Belus and Fallen are fantastic albums, though none shall ever tough the masterpiece that is Filosofem.
I would like to be wrong, but I don’t see how this kind of music can contribute to the White struggle, for it is predicated upon ugly, drug-fuled noise, practiced by, and followed by druggies, drunks, degenerates and missfits, sporting tattoos, scary hair and Mad Max clothing. It is n****r noise and n****r behaviour. It alienates ordinary White people.
The only way to make progress in this war, is for White advocates/nationalists to set an example, by being sober, law abiding, smartly presented and well mannered.
@Mike: exactly.
@Outsider: i find the whole genre trite, childish and counter-productive. Garbage in, garbage out.
This kind of music doesn’t do anything for me, but to each his own, I guess.
As for mainstream music being dominated by minorities I would question whether there still is a maintream, with the internet making distribution, and increasingly exposure, fairly easy for just about any artist.
The New Age genre, for example, which some people call neo-classical, seems to be white-dominated from what I can see. Unfortunately, many New Age artists have a left-leaning political outlook, which of course needs to be at least ignored, and criticized whenever possible. There is also a very strong Celtic influence within certain New Age music, more so than in any other current genre, I think.
@Mike:
I enjoyed reading your comment, Mike.
I haven’t listened to any of the music presented above, so I’m not really qualified to judge it. Even if I had listened to it, I’m probably not the right person to say whether or not it’s good.
But if, as you say, the music is fueled by drugs and a misfit kind of personality, then I agree that it probably isn’t helpful in the long run.
We need sober, moral White men and women to be the foundation of this movement. That’s how I feel. It really does start on the inside, with our minds and values.
The reason I haven’t listened to the music above is I try to be careful about what I allow into my inner world, my mind. I try to keep it pure, fill it with good things and keep out unnecessary or bad things. I’m not saying metal music is necessarily bad. Again, I’m not very familiar with the genre.
I certainly don’t mean any disrespect to fellow White people here who like or appreciate metal music.
@Richard: your sobering thoughtful comment has led me to think my own comments here have been ill-tempered and and imprudent.
True, I do not have a high opinion of this sort of music, but I made my opinions known in a hostile manner that any fan or creator of the music would take as a personal insult, and for that, readers, I apologize.
Rather than concentrate on what i think are this genre’s shortcomings, I would like to state what I think our youth should be spending their time with – music, art and literature that will truly challenge and inspire them. I don’t think young people – or any people – are looking for ‘the easy way’ out – they are seeking a challenge. That’s why epics and myths are so appealing.
that is why the wishy washy mainline protestant churches are bleeding members, while the evangelic ones that ask and require a more rigorous moral code, are thriving.
@me:
I’m humbled that you saw my comment in that light.
When I wrote my comment, I wasn’t thinking about your comments at all, at least not in a negative way.
And your frustration regarding heavy metal and its relationship to the White movement is totally understandable. These issues have a way of bringing up passionate feelings.
But back to the music, aren’t there studies that hint (or prove) that plants and animals benefit from classical music and suffer from heavy music? I don’t know if those are valid or not, but it wouldn’t surprise me if there is truth in that.
Take care, me. (Sounds strange to write that.)
I say its misnamed….Its white Metal
Black Metal sounds so, well, black. Vikings, anyway, are so pre-Christian. I don’t see starting a white Christian revolution using pagan music.
But that’s just me.
-R
Bunch of tired old Republican dads on here. Go cut your lawn, Buzz Killington. Then you can watch your favorite “Leave it to Beaver” episodes and marvel at the high art of it all. After that, you can re-iron you dockers and shine up your men’s Keds.
I’ll take black metal music over ANY of you boring old fools on here any day.
@ me and @ Mike: You gentlemen are on mark concerning the ordure that is “heavy metal” and “rock’n'roll”. Attempting to woo youth to a racial awakening through this garbage is akin to wooing them through pornography (“Hey, look at those hot bodies in action! Do you want them to look like the Missing Link? They will, based on these graphs, data tables, and…”).
The only music that is worth mentioning and using as a tool for a burgeoning racial consciousness is classical music. It is the non plus ultra that expresses the Western soul. We have Chant up to a bombastic Shostakovich symphony and everything in-between to choose from: take your pick and use accordingly. I listened to Rossini’s “William Tell” overture today and I was ready to go into battle. Let’s uplift youth not further degrade them.
@Fenria: You need a sound smacking. You are a jejune and pretentious nitwit. You should be cutting the lawn or disinfecting latrines instead of pontificating on things which you know nothing about.
@Fenria: but to what end? Not everything enjoyable is good for you.
Where does this music lead? Where does this lifestyle lead?
let’s take the example of video games. People can get caught up in this fantasy world, it might have all the ‘right’ LOTR imagery – but does it really motivate an individual or do they just become insulated and withdrawn into a fantasy world?
Call me skeptical, but I can’t imagine that it would lead to any proactive behavior in the real world.
I can’t imagine video games do much more than suck people’s time… there are claims they help with ‘strategy’ but most of them that i’ve seen are just ‘run and gun’ time wasters.
I’ll take black metal music over ANY of you boring old fools on here any day.
What, exactly, do you mean by this? Do you even know?
watch your favorite “Leave it to Beaver” episodes and marvel at the high art of it all
Again, what, exactly do you mean by this? Who called Leave it to Beaver or any TV show, ‘high art’?
@Richard: Regarding studies, I think there are some that certain rhythms cause ‘stress’ – but I more think that it provides a thought-restricting frame work for the mind.
Put it this way, try to have an abstract or complicated thought, and try to express that thought in hip-hop or ebonics. If your mind is ‘thinking’ in that ‘language’ its really not capable of much thought.
The less people know of a subject, the easier it becomes to make bombastic judgments about it, a trait most of you critics shows in abundance.
The viking/pagan/black metal bands are not all Christianity haters, and as I have tried to show with the links I have posted, they also sing old folk-tunes where the heathens are the baddies and the Christians the good guys.
If I might make a prediction though, based on the previous revival cycle, the next interest will be in medieval ballads, a subject that has been looked down upon by both metal musicians and university scholars.
A google search for “medieval ballad” will give both an introduction and it’s step-childish treatment compared to other musical expressions.
A medieval ballad, first in a more classical version:
Bergtatt – Villemann og Magnhild
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EBvHov4_zQw
And then a metal version by Storm:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gu3TAuw3ZJ8
You people who think you’re going to win back the white youth with classical music are hilarious, just hilarious. And this is from a person who loves classical music, but then again, I don’t need any “winning back”. Good luck getting your everyday wigger to listen to some Beethoven, hahaha!
Man, the time warp that most of you guys are in, it’s like blind people grasping at straws in the ether. Nevermind.
If these metal bands actually represented a kind of White racial awakening then they’d probably be outlawed by the European governments.
Having said that, this music is definitely preferrable to the rap/pop garbage that comes out of LA. Is Nordic metal good in and of itself? No. Is it better than nothing? Yes.
I find it absolutely appalling that one would shun Black Metal due to it’s Pagan and Norse roots because they’re worried about a “Christian White” movement. Especially considering the comment by “I” above about the Jewish stranglehold on the recording industry (WTF?!?). Apparently people easily forget that their Jesus was in fact a Jew. Neither here nor there however.
If you want good music that is motivated by white pride may I suggest Rahowa’s Cult of the Holy War as an example of utterly fantastic music that should easily welcome newcomers to the scene.
@fender:
“If these metal bands actually represented a kind of White racial awakening then they’d probably be outlawed by the European governments.”
If Scandinavia is some kind of avant guarde here, it actually seems to go in the other direction, where they are becoming more and more accepted by both the media and especially other musicians.
As to why it is so, there might be many explanations, from the pragmatic ones that say “at least they have stopped burning churches and killing each other”, to the ones who think that the separation of art and politics also applies to black metal when it applies to piss Christ.
Other again are just as tired of political correctness as we are, and support them out of spite, while others again actually like the music.
If we take the Dimmu Borgir concert with the Norwegian State Broadcasting Orchestra and Schola Cantorum, it was the idea of a well respected TV/Radio personality, and it also seems to have been supported by other so called pillars of main steam society.
This is FMPOV quite a feat, considering lyrics like this:
Forces of the northern light, assemble
Forces of the northern night, call to arms
Summoned by the secrets of sacrifice
Meeting destiny on the road we took to avoid it
As we only compete with ourselves
Left is that of a confident union
What bridge to cross and what bridge to burn
Deceit is everywhere you turn
We weed out the weak and their weep
Evolving, compulsively
Behaving, inconsistently
Yet the pulse is pounding
Restoration is the name
For those who are left in the game
Invocation in the name of our flame
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5bfKQAPwHU
Even more political incorrect is the song “Hill Norge” by the Dimmu vocalist together with another black metal musician.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1ZcPCTnY1HI
Lyrics is in Norwegian, but goes along these lines:
Proud Norwegian warriors… Hail Norway… Norwegians country… Proud Norwegian men… Hail Norway, for you I will fight… etc
“Is Nordic metal good in and of itself? No. Is it better than nothing? Yes.”
Musicians are constantly looking for inspiration that they both like and that they think will sell, just like any other professionals out there like architects, writers, carpenters, designers, etc.
When they notice that nationalism and political incorrectness sells, they will copy it in their fashion, and thus creating works of art that will appeal to people who don’t like metal music.
Since I have used medieval ballads as examples here, I might as well continue.
Modern version by the folk band Gåte of the ballad “Bendik og Årolilja”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GekKPIcoBlQ
A traditional version by Kirsten Berg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f7iLQSorsuM
And to round it off, I might as well round it off with a ballad that is found throughout Northern Europe called “Two Ravens”.
Russian version:
Nasledie Vagrants – The Ballad of The Two Ravens
German version:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3bNA_M_GMHE
Scottish version:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_ZCil_-sVM
I know nothing about traditional Nordic music, but found these stunning Scandinavian folk recordings on you tube:
A traditional Swedish folk song
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_9Dh_azZqyQ&feature=related
And singer/fiddler Arve Moen Bergset from Norway (traditional with orchestration)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dff7-Uhff8E
Largely because of Peter’s articles, I’m slowly gaining an appreciation for Nordic metal. I can’t say that I will ever be a fan, per se, but I’m starting to see (and understand) the connections between metal and the roots music it celebrates.
The melodies of tradition Scandinavian music are stark and haunting…ghostlike almost, and evoking a natural sense of myth and legend. I shouldn’t be surprised by the vague similarities with traditional Celtic and English folk music, given the history of western Europe, but I am somehow. I can see what Black Metal is trying to accomplish. I do think it’s valid, but I will probably always prefer the traditional renditions.
I believe I’ve genuinely found a new interest in traditional Scandinavian folk music. Thanks, Peter, for an enlightening article.
Anyone who bemoans the use of pop music as a medium to attract our youth toward developing a proud Eurocentric identity is not only suspicious but also insulting to the worthwhile efforts of giants like Dr. William Pierce. Imagine anonymous internet blowhards presuming to know better than Pierce by bickering over the medium!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OSNnW73m_Lw
Some great comments otherwise, tho. Thanks!
@Fenria: i don’t think you give youth enough credit….
I agree, you can’t give, say Shakespeare and Tennyson to someone with a third grade reading level and expect them to do anything but stare at it open mouthed and bewildered. And music appreciation does take some degree of musical literacy – which by the way, they were traditionally introduced to in church, particularly if they sung in the choir.
but even if it were so, shifting from one destructive unproductive lifestyle to another one that is potentially less destructive but nevertheless, unproductive and damaging may be ‘better’ but not enough to turn things around. I don’t see anything in the ‘rock and roll’ lifestyle that does, in fact just the opposite.
So the question is, as i proposed before, is this ;lifestyle and form of music like video games which don’t show any evidence they do anything to awaken consciousness or inspiring action? If not, it’s at best neutral at worst a time waster.
@Volksverhetzer:
A traditional version by Kirsten Berg
Very nice
@me:
Your dialogue with Fenria is futile. I agree with your sentiment about the music. My son loved that kind of music for a while (his friends even called him a viking) and I fought it, because a form of attitude, dress, behaviours etc. came with it. He’s gotten older, now 22 and is changing his tune to a softer, relaxing kind of music, that went along with his college studies or more advantages to combat school and work stress. I pointed out the degenerative aspect, the regression of this society and low standards of this country, which of course they don’t want to hear. I fought fierce (verbaly, but never below the belt) and I think I’ve succeded. But it is hard parental work, which working parents don’t want to do anymore. And if you do, you have to give up something, your time for yourself to the them (kids) Never did I permit to hear that music in my home, it felt like barbarious and abrasive to my ears and soul. I am glad he is coming around thru other people he meets, that support my views. It is tough with the youth of today. Whites have to work harder without the community support that no longer exists for us. He can hear his music in privat if he still cares to, as not to rob him of his love for music, but I don;t want to have to listen to it. He uses more his brain now, as a Teen, a tough age, his feelings, which why music in general speaks to them and appeals to. Gentle but persistent stiring, never loosing the wheel untill they can drive their own life creatively, productively, with purpose and meaning, in a civilized manner, hopefuly to leave this earth a little better then they found it. Money is a means, but never the goal. Race and Genes matter to that end, and in the preservation of it. Those who have it will survive, and those who don’t will perish. It is all hard work, education, our children, our communities, our earth. I have never known America to be anything else but Dog eat Dog! A concept that was totaly foreign to me. Whites have their work cut out for them, if they want to preserve anything European in this country. (without regressing to metal Viking music)
@Matthias: Anyone who bemoans the use of pop music as a medium to attract our youth toward developing a proud Eurocentric identity is not only suspicious but also insulting
ok, so why not have WN hip-hop /rap music?
@European: Good comments. I don’t expect to ‘convince’ any ‘death metal’ fan change their ways, I just wish K.M would be a bit more prudent.
I look back on music i enjoyed as a teenager (fortunately I started to grow out of it in college) and I realize how destructive it was. It’s so ironic that they ‘sell’ rebellion – (the whole Rock and Roll lifestyle and attitude) but really all me and other kids were doing was making big ethnically owned music companies richer, while convincing ourselves to adapt every culture, life and society destroying attitude possible.
Yes, there were good tunes here and there.. and probably with this ‘metal’ stuff there are (but like rap just not my taste) but overall, is the lifestyle and identity healthy? my gut says no.
@European:
European, me: there is a downside to every possibility of opportunity. The metal stuff has downsides involving increased risk of one or more of…bad clothes, bad ideas, bad company, drink, drugs, sex, disease, violence and so on. Depending on their personality and psychological fault lines, for some young people this is the move that destroys the rest of their lives. Some even die when they wouldn’t have otherwise.
However the same is true of getting into any new thing. The same is true of getting in with mountain climbers, or even camping societies. In the end it depends who else is there, and what they introduce you to, and how you respond to that.
European – Personal testimony is always valuable, and ‘m not saying you are wrong. But it can also be misleading. Particularly in a situation like this where we are a people literally staring at our own death. There are lots of things I can envisage that need to happen, but that I wouldn’t want a loved one to be anywhere near to. I wouldn’t want a kid of mine getting into black metal necessarily. There’s lots of emotions that come into play around loved ones.
But in terms of whether black metal is good or bad for the whites at this moment in history. Well, that’s actually a pretty easy calculation to do, since right now it’s like we’re standing there in an arid desert with hardly a sign of green foliage or drop of water in sight.
Is it good for the whites? Is there anything else going on right now? I mean…is there another movement that, like black metal for all its failings, at least holds out some sort of hope for us. That talks about our mythology and creates a possibility – maybe an untapped possibility – for a connection to the young. That creates connections to white visionaries and leaders…who may have tatooes up and down their arms but hell, at least THEY’VE SEEN IT. At least they’ve done that.
Also, it’s worth remembering that the look and feel of black metal, the hair, hirsute….rough but heartful look…none of this is invented by the metal movement. It’s an authentic strand of what it is to be European. Look at this Scottish drum and pipe band. Stay with it…it’s part of the same thing. So for that reason alone…there’s something important there at least in potential. It may not be the high culture that some visitors to this site hold up as the pinnacle of European civilization. But we are a complex multi-layered people. And don’t forget who among us always wins the wars for us… http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5IxKM77KM64
@European:
“) Never did I permit to hear that music in my home, it felt like barbarious and abrasive to my ears and soul. I am glad he is coming around thru other people he meets, that support my views. It is tough with the youth of today. … He can hear his music in privat if he still cares to, as not to rob him of his love for music, but I don;t want to have to listen to it. He uses more his brain now”
I think it is more probable that your son have learned to lie and hide his inner life for you.
It is not the worst of fates to happen to a father-son relationship, but FMPOV, it is of lesser value than one based on an ideal of mutual respect and honesty.
I also find it ironic that learned people say that appreciation of classical music is an acquired taste, but at the same time seem totally oblivious that the same applies to other forms of musical expressions.
@Jim
What actually is hilarious, is that you found a Scandinavian Christian Christmas carol through all this talk about heathens, black metal and satanism.
An instrumental version of the same tune with Tine Thing Helseth on trumpet with The Salvation Army’s Territorial Brass Orchestra might thus be fitting. :)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FwOrZgxdRQs&feature=related
For those who still think that what is called Viking-metal always revolves about Thor, Odin, raping and plundering, here is another metal version of a folksong by Myrkgrav. For all I know this song also might have parallels in other North-European languages.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G25ZWp7C7yA
From the description in the video.
This is a traditional folksong from Denmark.
Its based around two sisters, where the youngest has more luck in love than the oldest.
Jealousy is a vital part of the story. as the older girl murder the younger one since she also wants luck in love.
What she did not see was two troubadours who made instruments of her sisters dead body, and played them at her wedding after she had stolen her dead sister’s fiancée.
This Casted a spell over her, and the morning after the wedding, she had miraculously been burned to death.
The song originally has 24 verses so Lars Jensen halved it.
My husband is actually in one of these Norwegian black metal bands, or rather, the band is his, and has gone through many incarnations since it’s birth in the early 90′s along with contemporaries such as Darkthrone and Mayhem. My husband is a Norwegian who came here to the States to marry me and have a family. He also is a student and has a full time job.
When he’s onstage performing, he’s a long haired, war painted Viking spitting his venom to the world. When he’s at home, he’s a normal, reasonably sober, funny, brilliant, hard working, wonderful husband and father who takes great interest in training his dogs and studying the basics of veterinary care. He’s also a trucker, and if you ate any food from a store today, you might just be able to thank him for getting it there for you.
You people who think you know so much about people like my husband because his looks and stage persona scare you, you people don’t even know your own people. You don’t even recognize the raw, un-neutered white male spirit still alive out there. That’s just sad. White men try to rise up all over the white world and you fools just beat them down with your cross. My husband is more inherently white than any of you. He’s more in touch with his ancestry and heritage than any of you. My husband comes from a time when white men didn’t kneel before a jewish god and shiver at the thought of combat and strength.
My husband’s music embodies the raw strength of inherent whiteness, as does metal music in general. You people, so worried that the music is too loud, or too brutal, or too violent, you have NO idea what it took for our ancestors to keep hold of Europe for thousands of years, and predictably, a Christianized white world has lost hold of it’s nations in the space of half a century.
You guys keep telling whites to behave. Behave themselves into the grave.
@Fenria:
here here fenria – but don’t forget that it shouldn’t be expected that individuals have knowledge about their own peoples, even heroes who have woken up and decided to do something (but maybe not yet know what). It’s process of learning and teaching.
But the truth is, this black metal thing….although it has potential and it is an authentic window into an important aspect of the European heart, it isn’t on its own a transformational movement. But it could become one component of a transformational movement. So one important thing for you and your husband to be realizing, is that you must not become insular in your minds, or starting envisioning a situation of rebellion against convention European norms.
You will have to be part of what saves those conventional European norms.
@Fenria: When he’s onstage performing, he’s a long haired, war painted Viking spitting his venom to the world. When he’s at home, he’s a normal, reasonably sober, funny, brilliant, hard working, wonderful husband and father
So what? there are plenty of jewish executives who don’t listen to rap or hip hop but push it on white youth. Drug dealers who don’t use drugs.
In fact, your comment reveals that he essentially knows the lifestyle he advertises is destructive.
@Fenria: you have NO idea what it took for our ancestors to keep hold of Europe for thousands of years, and predictably, a Christianized white world has lost hold of it’s nations in the space of half a century.
this is an absolutely senseless comment. A de-Christianized west has unraveled western civilization.
I have no idea? First thing, Europe wasn’t ‘held together’ preChristian germanic tribes repeatedly failed to hold back invaders and conquests. pre-Christian peoples cannot stand up to islam. Never have. It was Charles Martel, the Hammer, at Tours, the Knights of Malta, the Poles (a deeply religious peoples) the Spanish Christians who pushed back the moors, the hordes and the ottamans. Open up a history book for goodness sake..
Christians founded universities like Oxford, Cambridge, the Sorbonne. Odinists? Please don’t give the spinal tap worthy ‘ancient knowledge of the druids nonsense.
and… while we’re at it… Infanticide was common among pagans of all stripes. If you didn’t want a baby you left it to die of exposure. (infanticide still occurs among pagan peoples such as Asian indians. ) and it is not accident that atheist ‘ethical’ academics are proposing the same thing (peter singer for example). and of course human sacrofice occurred among nordic pagans – and black metal satanists..
I sincerely doubt you have thought this through… where does our moral sense, our moral reverence for human life come from? And if we take that away, or just make up our own new age religion like odonists do, then we are regressing to barbarity.
@Fenria: white men didn’t kneel before a jewish god and shiver at the thought of combat and strength.
your husband vs. a Knight of Malta.. hmmm who would win that one… call me crazy, but I’d bet on the Knight of Malta (700 hundred of them & 3000 Christian regulars held out against a 30-40,000 + Muslim invasion )
You have just insulted men far more brave than your husband or anyone posting here, will ever be. Getting up on stage in make up and snarling is not bravery, in fact, I think it’s immaturity.
But your comment reveals an astonishing ignorance (i am sorry I know of no other way to put it) of European history. It is one thing to not know these things, it is quite another to have such negative opinions about something you know nothing about it.
@Iranian for Aryans: Fenria:….
Do you notice how the more the conversation expands, the more she resorts to illogical insults- in fact, that’s all she’s done here, say nasty things and call people stupid.. but can’t provide a sound argument to our objections..
I’d say this is a pretty good example of effects of the black metal lifestyle on people with limited cognitive abilities.
I say this half jokingly, but in all seriousness, does anyone reading her comments really think such a mindset and such hostility to the very fabric of western civilization is going to gain broad appeal? and if it did what sort of ‘society’ would we have?
@me:
me……is it not worth just considering that unity when it comes will have to be across a very broad church of white people? There may be lots you don’t have in common with black metal fans, but surely it is important to think of the things that you have in common. Not for the sake of the merits of black metal in particular, but for the sake of a general principle.
In better times we might all have been enemies, but such is the awfulness of these times that our differences are eclipsed entirely by what makes us brothers.
@Mickey Meadows: me……is it not worth just considering that unity
do you think Feneria’s comments and attitude are ‘unifying’? She’s as ignorant and hostile to western civilization as any cultural marxist.
@me:
Are you saying you are simply reacting to Feneria’s attitude rather than stating your truth?
Between you and a black metal enthuisiast, whose natural responsibility would it be to create a shared sense of common unity?
The unity does exist. She believes we are a people. You believe we are a people. In the world we currently live in, just that alone makes the two of you peas in a pod. Give you a most rare connection and sense of peril and purpose.
From the NA:
“National Alliance founder Dr. William Pierce hated Rock music; he detested the sound of it. However, he realized that two or three generations had been raised on it, and that if we were to reach our youth, we needed to go to where they were at, and not where we’d like them to be. Dr. Pierce realized that we’d be unable to reach today’s youth with Bach and Beethoven, but with bands on the Resistance label such as the Angry Aryans, Bound For Glory, and Max Resist.
A few people have suggested to me that perhaps the National Alliance should distance themselves from Resistance Records and the whole Racialist Rock scene. Well, resistance music is a powerful tool that has the potential to reach tens of millions of White youth in a way that neither books nor speeches can. ”
But anonymous internet blowhards know better than the good Doc after all. That is why they have done so much more for the cause than he.
@Mickey Meadows: her attitude is destructive and hostile. No I don’t support her or any black metal/odonist back to nature movement. It’s childish adolescent and ignorant.
What people believe, no matter how sincere doesn’t matter if that belief is destructive. If someone advocated everyone dropping acid as a way to expand consciousness and therefore come up with great ideas to save western civilization, and was sincere about it, that would a sincere, but destructive belief.
I have simply asked, several times in the course of this discussion, whether the lifestyle and music are not counter productive. I used and example of video games – i sincerely doubt they do anything proactive or productive. (I am waiting for some idiot to post something in support of the norway shooter who played some violent video game and pumped himself up on steroids).
Feneria has responded to this with increased hostility and insulting comments. She essentially said that Christians were cowards. This is beyond ignorant. She claims that western civilization has fallen apart in less than 50 years because it is christian. Her own words:
Now please, ask yourself if this is productive. You apparently agreed saying “here here here” (BTW, for future reference, it is hear, not here, but please find something better to cheer about ;) ).
@Matthias: oh yeah, they’ve done wonders haven;t they. Big national party and all that. ..
I have very simply asked for proof of its effectiveness and whether or not it lifestyle is helpful. Based on my own experience with rock music, I suspect it is not. There are better ways to reach young people. Replacing one set of low expectations, with another is hardly an improvement.
But it is telling that he detested it, isn’t it? He realized that it was pretty essential in bringing down and destroying social mores, and community fabric.
To all the regular posters here who I appreciate very much for their thoughts, comments, critic, and helping me to see or examen myself, thoughts and actions better.
I am not sure why I am always seen as a “male”, when in fact I am a German female. Perhaps it has to do that I grew up with three intellectual brothers, and my mother always thought I should have been another boy. ( Not sure, but I am not a feminist, I love being a woman, I just happen to have a thinking head on my shoulders as well)
But it does feel strange to be read as a male. But don’t stop your critic on me, I appreciate it, and it helps me to grow, learn and teach my son to be proud of who he is, and give him the instruments, a clear mind, education etc. to create a good life for himself. ( I am unfortunatly a single mom trying to beat the odds attributed to kids with only one parent. And I want to beat the odds. He sees his father 2x a year in Europe ) As for the music, I know none of us can escape totaly the “Zeitgeist”. Somehow we live in it at every developmental age, and what seems harmful, we turn into learning, awareness, or experience. WE all learn from errors as well, but it remains harmful if we turn a blind eye. And I refuse to go that route.
So thank you everyone for your HONEST FEEDBACK. I need male guidance to raise my son, and I learn so much from every one of you. Deeply appreciated and the best to everyone.
TO KM the admins ect.
There are some interesting articles here (L Darkmoon’s for example) but I really don’t see what you expect to gain by the likes of Sunic, the black/death metal/odonist stuff. Neopaganism is cultural marxism disguised in rather tasteless clothing and hairstyles.
It promotes sloth, cowardice and withdrawn adolescent fantasies – it will no more help the ’cause’ than a star trek convention – and at least those kids study..
Please serious consider what you’re doing. Thanks.
@me:
As far as I’m concerned finding unifying factors is much more important. Another consideration is that even when WN movements are not unified, that’s ok, just as long as they don’t waste their time fighting eachother.
The Jews have dominated us by learning an instinctual sense of ‘what is good for the jews’. This allows for Jewish movements to exist in often totally contradictory and mutually antagonistic directions. Yet somehow such movements always manage to have an impact on the world that is good for the jews. Both individually, and even collectively.
So it’s fine “me” that you hate the black metal people and believe they stand for all that is wrong with Western society. Just so long as you don’t bother wasting your time trying to harm them, rather instead concentrate on whatever your contribution is going to be.
Are you planning to make a life contribution to the survival of our people?
@Richard:
Richard. Let’s say you are right. How do you then deal with a situation that starts out with a connection to young people into black metal and resonating with a sense of racial identity? Do you insult them and push them away, or do you engage them and try to think of ways to influence them?
This very much does have significance for how you respond on a website like this. Some of the replies here might have the impact of sending some people away now with a sense of hostility toward conventional white civililization, where they might otherwise have gone away very differntly.
This isn’t a criticism of you personally, or of anyone particularly. It’s not to make anyone feel bad about themselves. It’s more about what happens next time.
@European:
European – thanks for sharing something about your life. You certainly don’t come across necessarily like a man. I suppose people have to choose a convention….I tend to assume someone is male unless they indicate otherwise. However I could easily do it the other way around. It’s just that women are more understanding about being assumed male than men can be about being assumed female.
@me:
me – it’s hear hear? Darn, I’m sorry about that :O) But look, yes I cheered her sentimements because within them there were things to cheer involving white identity. I wasn’t really supporting anything she was saying about you or anyone else. How could any intelligent person read things that way, because how could she possibly know what you are really like. She was just expressing a feeling she has about the world. You were just playing a walk on part.
To me, what was more important in that moment was to remind her of what unifies us.
This is not a game you know. This is about our survival. It’s really important to move beyond the idea that you personally matter or I personally matter or she matters. What matters is the survival of our people because we are going to die, as a people.
@Mickey Meadows: So it’s fine “me” that you hate the black metal people and believe they stand for all that is wrong with Western society.
I didn’t say I hated them, I simply said I think the genre and lifestyle is counter-productive.
Clearly, they hate western civilization, at least as it stands in the past 1500 years. So in advocating its destruction they are indeed my enemies.
No one can predict the future, but I think it’s a laughable and sad fantasy that this ‘music’ and lifestyle will ever become anything other than destructive. to use the example of rock music – it has been an effective toxin applied to our youth.
Try this exercise. Try to express a complex or meaningful thought in ‘hip hop’ language. You can’t. Likewise, I suspect embracing this lifestyle and listening to this music is brain-numbing. The out of touch with reality comments by fenria are probably at least in part, a result of embracing this lifestyle/music.
@Mickey Meadows: If you’re interested in the Etymology, Here is a history of hear hear (almost a mother goose rhyme, eh? ):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hear,_hear
anyway, I didn’t so much care about her comments towards us- though its’s a pretty poor response to our arguments. I was concerned that you were endorsing her attitudes towards western civilization. I apologize if I have mis-interpreted your remarks.
@me:
me, you ask me to try a thought experiment which I tried and I can see where you are coming from. Now I will ask you to try a thought experiment. What would you rather: someone with the best education and tastes in music and culture but who vehemently denies euro-descendents are a people, and supports mass immigration and will not budge; or someone who is into black metal and maybe hasn’t had the best chances in life and has all these bad idea and theories about the world, but who has totally realized that we are a people and that we are being destroyed as a people?
I mean, on that hill where we see our final triumph or make our desperate last stand, which one of those two are most likely to show up? Which one do you think you can influence about the subjects that you personally consider most pressing at this moment in our history?
@me: @me: Where are the Knights of Malta nowadays? Although I am a christian myself I have to admit that Christianity has turned into a feminine coward-cult in the last few decades. I don’t know any christians which would pick up the sword in defence of Western Civilization.
Besides, Christianity did not strengthen the Northmen, but the Northmen strengthened Christianity. It were the just-converted pagans from Normandy which gave the Christians in the Mediterennean the force to push the Muslims back.
@Richard: There are indeed such studies. The best-controlled one of which I am aware is now more than thirty years old, and its findings, while widely mocked, have never been empirically discredited so far as I know.
Over the course of a month (or perhaps several months; I have forgotten, alas, but I think it was a month), three sizable and identical collections of plants were kept in identical light, temperature, and humidity conditions and fed and watered to precisely the same extent. The control group—let’s call it A—was in a silent environment. Group B was constantly (i.e., 24/7) exposed to music by Bach, the Brandenburgs, inter alia. Group C was constantly exposed to rock music; it was identified at the time, but again, I don’t recall what it was—nor frankly do I give a damn.
Despite the fact that in real life, genuine music is never played at levels that cause physical pain and do damage to the auditory structures, whereas rock—and a fortiori its bastard offspring in all their many black, Hispanic, Semitic, and Viking disguises—is never performed in any other way,, the experiment also approximately matched the decibel levels at which the two sets of musical materials were played. (Matching can never be completely precise in such circumstances, of course. Virtually all “popular” music, whatever its genre, is played at a uniform volume level; Western art music is practically alone in the world in cultivating contrasts of loudness in parallel with contrasts of timbre, pitch, and mass [i.e., numbers of instruments or voices].)
But I digress. At the end of the allotted time, the plants in the control group, Group A, had grown to the extent expected. The Group B plants had flourished; they exhibited between 10% and 50% more growth than those in A. More than half the plants in Group C, however, had died, and the remainder were much smaller and much less healthy than those in A. Most of the reminder also died within another week or two.
To believe that this study is irrelevant to human life, especially young human life, is to believe that the mass media disinterestedly tell you all you need to know to prosper materially and, particularly, otherwise. Something analogous is being done with cell phones, whose microwave radiation is a known carcinogen—that is, known to all except the great mass of cell phone users. Every Tribal trial lawyer under the age of forty is salivating in anticipation of the day, some twenty or twenty-five years hence, when he can start chasing the ambulances that carry the tidal wave of brain cancer victims to Tribally run hospitals, hospices, and nursing homes.
Enough said, save for this: Richard, you, along with Mike and (most vigorously and tirelessly of all) “me,” are struggling heroically against overwhelming odds on this thread. It is plain that you aren’t so deluded as to expect to be thanked for standing up for clearsightedness, decency, mental health, and ordinary garden-variety common sense—let alone such things as moral and cultural consistency and God-given human dignity (which this vulgar and repellent noise gnaws away at every time it is listened to or even tolerated in one’s presence). The vast majority of the arguments being hurled against you amount to saying, “Screw you! I like to fart in the elevator; it’s a white thing to do, and no candy-assed fairy like you is ever going to appeal to manly guys like me with your Jew-loving Christard crap . . .” et cetera ad infinitum. Thus spake the true products of Modernity.
However futile it may be to do so, I thank you for your good work, and I hope you keep it up.
Postscript to “me”: congratulations for noting that you need to keep a leash on that temper of yours. It’s no more than the hallmark of a rational adult, of course, but there ain’t a lot of that rationality commodity on the shelves hereabout, is there?
@Dirk: Mainstream religions have turned non christian and post modern, like everything else. The whole idea of Chivlary, knightly ideals are uniquely Christian, well proven, and historical. Revive those. What the odinists are proposing is a sweeping throwing out of our entire order and creating a new one, simply claiming it’s old. It is not. What did Durant say? To build a civilization takes centuries to build and one day destroy.
Your second assertion simply isn’t true.
@Mickey Meadows: What would you rather
you left a key verb out. Have? Be? did you mean what would I prefer?
Well it goes back to what I said earlier, someone could be sincere and wrong. Let’s say I was helping sick people. and someone came along with a medicine and was sincere in wanting to help them but the medicine they were dishing out was poison. Does it really matter how sincere they were?
I guess my answer would be that we need to appeal to the reason and ration of the educated one, and offer moral guidance and direction to the black metal guy.
@Pierre de Craon: Most of kind of you sir!
worth repeating:
The vast majority of the arguments being hurled against you amount to saying, “Screw you! I like to fart in the elevator; it’s a white thing to do, and no candy-assed fairy like you is ever going to appeal to manly guys like me with your Jew-loving Christard crap . . .” et cetera ad infinitum. Thus spake the true products of Modernity.
Sadly, that’s what they , don’t get… their behavior is the exact sort of ‘product’ the Frankfort school and others had in mind. Yes, maybe it has a different veneer than they intended, but the results are the same.
@me:
@ me, you are absolutley right and correct. I share your views from the experience with my son. He was against everything I ever taught him, and for a while I thought I would not get him to see the light, or come around. You are right, they can get stuck in this kind of music as it holds their emotions in fantasies and in that scene, and the young end up in drugs and loathing etc. If it comes near me I fight it whether they are white or not. It is survival of our race, what we believe thru trial and error = experience over Generations, reason, the values we stand for etc. etc. ,anything else is weakening what makes us strong. Rock, Metal, Rap, much is degrading our cultures, and I am not saying all of it, but most of it, though I personaly like none of it.
And I’ve said the same thing to my son, just as you have said, what took thousands of years to build in knowledge, and I mean hard thinking Europeans, the development of man, laws, values and so on, we can flush it all down, to near extinction, in a very short time.
I see the best of America was build on European People and knowledge. But it is increasingly undermining the People and values who’ve made this country great. Replaced by people of a FEEL GOOD. Disasterous!
Keep up the good work and fight, I hope you get alot of support where ever you are. Thank you for all your comments.
@me:
You are the one who is actually totally disrespectful. You have a narrow spectrum into which all whites must fall in order for you to approve of them and this spectrum is completely dictated on what YOU particularly like and don’t like. You would spit on my husband, even though you don’t know him at all, simply because you dislike the kind of music he’s into. You’re so typical. No wonder this movement, if one could even call it that, is so fractured. You can take your jewish god and your christian “revolution” and shove them. I and many other white people want nothing to do with your idiotic jew worship dressed up in western garb. And please, do not begin to assume that you know my level of historical knowledge. You know nothing at all about me.
I am hostile towards you because you and people like you are hostile towards ANYONE who doesn’t fit completely into your personal niche of who an individual should be, and your relentless bible thumping makes me ill. Ill enough to walk away from all of you and your so called movement and go be white by myself, for myself.
Seriously, all this movement has become is relentless fawning over the baby jebus and non stop finger wagging. You people suck. What a bunch of pantywaisted pollyannas. You remind me of the horrible, boring people at the dinner parties my parents dragged me to when I was young; the ones even my parents didn’t like.
The “classical music only!” crowd is basically saying that White people should abstain from any further musical innovation and especially not use any of the musical technology invented since around 1900. That doesn’t sound like a very White thing to do.
All music is degenerate and appeals to the passions. However all music is not equal. To the degree that it appeals to higher ideals and less to physicality the better it is. Therefore Rap is the lowest, Viking/Folk metal is much higher, classical is higher still, rejection of music in favor of books is higher still, math and science is the pinnacle.
If young people listen to rap they are likely to race mix or at least develop an anti-White world view. A Black/Viking metal fan will love his race and history. Most will not develop into a higher man, but will at least remain among his own long enough for the opportunity as happened with many Skinheads before them.
Hail Black Metal! Death to music!
I think that conversation went pretty well? :O)
@Fenria:
One can imagine these ‘horrible boring people. They probably spoke in complete sentences, brought up facts you didn’t like or didn’t find as interesting as
Once again you could not refute anything I said, so you create a strawman.
You said several things that were completely out of touch with with reality (see your quote about how a ‘ Christianized Europe fell apart in less than half a century’ – perhaps if you had listened to some of those ‘boring’ people or read some ‘boring’ books you might have some clue that western civilizatoin is a little bit older than your grandparents. Perhaps if you understood what was at stake, or at least learned to appreciate that some ‘boring old people’ do understand, … oh never mind; You’re not even reading this anyway, and frankly I have seen no evidence that you are even willing to make an effort to try to understand what we’re discussing here.
I suppose it would be silly to ask for evidence of my ‘bible thumping’ , because there is none. I simply asked you to provide some moral basis for finding infanticide (big word, I know, look it up) immoral; or human sacrifice, for that matter.
@I: No one said anything of the kind. As with feneria, you create a strawman to argue with. Why can’t you address what we’ve said?
@Mickey Meadows: :)
@Fenria:
I did not disparage your husband. You said this.
From what I understand from your rather limited grasp on the English language, you think your husband displays some ‘pre-Christian’ bravery that Christians simply don’t have (Again, perhaps if you listened to some of those boring people or read boring books you’d know how to express yourself more clearly). Of course, you also implied that “pre-Christian” is say, 1950 but we’ll let that go at the moment.
I simply made what anyone with any historical knowledge would consider a reasonable statement. A black metal “musician” /animal care student would probably lose to fight to one of the Knights of Malta who you claimed ‘shivered’ at the thought of combat and strength. I also said that any Knight of Malta displayed more courage and did more for Western civilization than anyone writing here, myself included. A reasonable observation it’s not ‘putting anyone down’. It’s called being realistic; but I don’t’ expect a product of ‘self esteem’ education to be realistic.
@Fenria:
Well, I do know you don’t write very well. I am not talking about typos. I’ve made them there; and have sometimes posted something without a finished sentence. That is one of the hazards un-editable commenting. No, I am talking about something deeper than that. Your writing is indicative of someone with limited literacy, to put it delicately. Again this is not a insult or an ad hominem it’s self evident.
If tried to run in the NCAA 400 meters, it would be pretty obvious that I was not qualified and had no business being there. I would not take it as a blow to my self esteem, but rather a reliable indicator of my athletic abilities.
Likewise you’ve written nothing that indicates you have an even passing knowledge of western history. I am not’ ‘assuming’ I am basing my assessment on what you said. If someone said “Hitler lost the battle of Gettysburg’, I might take it as a gaff, but if that person didn’t say ‘oops’ and continued to say such things, I would conclude they were poorly educated. .
readers Poor grammar aside (and I don’t mean the ‘of who’ but rather ‘completely into your personal niche’ – think about the inanity of that for a moment.), This is perhaps the key passage in this entire conversation. It shows how deeply the post-modern mindset is ingrained in anyone who doesn’t consciously try to eradicate it.
Yeah, it’s all just personal choices. There are no truths. Everything’s relative.
@Fenria:
I don’t know Fenria’s age. But she’s married, so let’s guess the average marriage age for women, 24. Read the above quote with that in mind. It sounds like a twelve year old, – and a petulant one at that.
Look at the other quotes by the pro-black metal fans here. Many display adolescent thought processes – they cannot answer or refute, so they simply become angry. Like children. We can safely assume most are in what traditionally was considered adulthood. I am sure we would find the same or worse among wiggers, but I think there is a relationship between adapting this ‘lifestyle’ and music and immaturity. The same of course goes for mainstream rock music.
Again this is not to say that one can’t enjoy a song here and there, or that there are not talented and sincere musicians, but as a lifestyle or ‘movement’ our enemies could not do better.
Again let’s stop setting low expectations for our youth. A challenge is what inspires people not catering to their worst instincts that’s what the 1960s cultural marxists did to the baby boom generation.
@me:
me – something isn’t right with this picture regarding how you describe these people on the one hand, and how you then speak and interact with them, on the other hand.
Having identified in someone, perhaps a younger age, perhaps a lower social/economic level, perhaps a less fortunate access to education, it’s hard to then explain the way have apparently set out deliberately to mock, demean, belittle, other than as rather spiteful, unkind and cruel.
My guess is that you might be imagining you come out of this rather well, but my guess is that for most people you come out stinking rotten. What positive thing have you added here?
@Mickey Meadows:
Expecting a 20 year old to behave like an adult is not demeaning them. It’s treating them with dignity. Catering to their vanity, their weakness, the worst in them, is precisely what self esteem based education, confidence men/self help gurus and popular media do.
I am fully aware that some, perhaps most, of the ‘black metal’ supporters here are less educated and probably come from lower economic backgrounds. I have not said ‘you’re dumb’ or ugly, or stupid. I have pointed out the shortcomings in their arguments, and have offered , what I think at least, are legitimate concerns and criticisms.
Have I received one reasoned response? I have received mindless insults and imaginary objections “you just want everyone to listen to what you like”.
Have I ever even cared about what they say about me? I have only responded to their insults towards the west, our ancestors and our history (while pretending to revive some imaginary past ran through a Lord of the Rings/Spinal tap aesthetic and devoid of any truth) .
I expect more of them, By your actions I would guess you don’t and you inherently think they are beneath reason, which is why you continually chastise me and ignore Feneria’s insults. You are ‘spoiling’ her the same way her parents and teachers probably did, and how this insulated adolescent fantasy world of black metal does.
@Mickey Meadows:
I would like to expand on this a little. We cannot afford have adults behaving like children anymore. The Baby boom generation did, they had a big self indulgent party for themselves. The baby boomers ‘did their own thing’ flouted societal conventions and social mores, ignored their obligations, made up their own religion(s) , their own ethics (or lack of) shunted anything that might get in the way of their ‘self esteem’ and ‘fulfillment’ rather than challenge themselves, they dumbed down. Can anyone look at a Rolling Stones concert, with Mick Jagger strutting around and shaking his behind while over-weight baby boomers with bald heads and gray pony tails shake their fists in the air and not think them buffoons? (except of course the economically astute Mick Jagger) .
we are living with the results of the baby boomers actions. It’s not an accident that both Tony Blair and Bill Clinton are the ones who consciously tipped the demographic scale in the UK and US. It was their lingering adolescent hatred of ‘the man’. In a single generation they brought western civilization to the abyss.
@Mickey Meadows: Lastly, I have met plenty of less educated people from poorer backgrounds (and they don’t always go hand in hand) with more dignity and courage than me. Well, at least you won’t find that hard to believe ;)
I am sure everyone here has met a similar people. Do you think they would more inclined to agree with me or you?
Have you ever read the book Captains Courageous? It may be ‘idealism’ but such people were commonplace a century ago. All you’re doing here MM, is catering to low expectations. You’re saying they can do no better.
People with less education and less money are closer to the edge of poverty and despair – a wealthy person can have a drug problem and get by (though it destroys many) a poor man will destroy his family. It no accident that the sixties revolution hurt the poorest the most.
and if you still think that the ‘uneducated’ or poor can only be expected to attend black metal concerts, and not really understand and educate themselves, ead this
http://www.city-journal.org/html/14_4_urbanities-classics.html
“In the nineteenth century, Shakespeare could still attract enthusiastic, rowdy working-class audiences, who commented loudly about the quality of the performances.”
“In the mining towns of South Wales, colliers had pennies deducted from their wages to support their own libraries, more than 100 of them by 1934. The miners themselves determined which books to buy. One such library, the Tredegar Workmen’s Institute, devoted 20 percent of its acquisitions budget to philosophy. Another spent 45 pounds on the Oxford English Dictionary. (In the best of times, a miner could not earn much more than a pound a day.) There were sophisticated literary debates down in the pits, where one collier heard high praise for George Meredith.”
@me
What you are experiencing is what I call HFS (Hysterical Female Syndrome). You will see it on many boards. It comes from the mistake of a subconscious belief in sexual equality and then engaging in manly conversation on that premise with a female.
That being said, I share with her a support for Black and Viking metal. I would hope that our people will reach higher. However one must begin somewhere. Young people are far more likely to pick up a book on European history after listening to Burzum or Amon Amarth than Jay-z or Kanye West. Or at least if they’re to remain idiots they will end up with a White mate and we will hopefully have another shot at their kids. A case in point would be the Black Metal band Vintersorg who released a CD entitled “Cosmic Genesis” dedicated to Copernicus,
I’d like to thank Peter for writing this article and to OQ for publishing it. We linked it on our blog. Amren has published a couple of articles on the subject as well. It’s nice to see our youth looking to their own history for inspiration instead of shaking their butts to negro music. In fact Jay-Z just published a book entitled “Butts” which is a picture book of course. By contrast Burzum wrote “Vargsmall.”. The choice really couldn’t be more clear.
As to xianity, it had a good run. It’s time to move on to science. It’s time for xianity ot pass so that it can be remembered fondly. It’s begun to wear out its welcome.
Great thread and comments.
For your Female Hysterical Syndrome, not all females are feminists. If a woman is smart or strong, doesn’t mean she ascribes to Feminism. I am tired of women being lumped into one big trash bin. I cannot help it if I am smart or determined or I have convictions. But I am not a feminist. I don’t buy into “equality” or any of the other crap perpetrated by feminists.
I noticed a lot of WN men just talk about this, but date liberal White women or nonwhites in real life. To me, WN/Nat Socialism is about my core beliefs, so I don’t compromise them in the real world. I have no need to, I am not “holding back”, this is HOW I want to live.
I am not engaged in a generational age-war. I am tired of different age groups blaming each other. That is what the enemy wants, for us to faction out, and fight among ourselves. There are problems in all age groups, but let’s bond together as Whites. I am not religious, but I embrace anyone who is for a White world.
While I am not the greatest metal enthusiast, I love music, and the expression with Black Metal is awesome.
I admire the strength and energy behind it.
When people say it won’t appeal to the masses, what the heck, the masses don’t acknowledge what is wrong in the world.
Whenever there is an attempt to win “everyone over”, it never works out. So if only a few are inspired, let that inspiration be good and true.
Rock on.
@Jim:
If you’re interested in Swedish traditional music check out:
Emma Hardelin
Triakel
Garmarna
Emma is the best Swedish singer.
Celtic music is quite good as well:
Karen Casey
Planxty
Bothy Band
Kevin Crawford
Seamus Tansey
I could go on forever.
@teutonic1:
Right…just because a woman is not a feminist, doesn’t mean she has to buy into this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LS37SNYjg8w
(will make you laugh guaranteed)
Like many commentators here, this kind of music does nothing for me.
However, has anyone heard of a wonderful, uplifting music which can be said to be the “New Classical”, that originated in Germany called “Trance”? Although it hasn’t caught on in the USA except in the major cities (New York, L.A., Miami, etc.) many young people in Europe love it!
I feel that European Trance has the same “spirit” or “essence” as European Classical, because they both for the most part have an uplifting quality to them. I am a very sensitive person, and I literally get goosebumps from listening to both forms of music, and sometimes I am moved to tears because of the beauty.
From Wikipedia:
https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/Trance_music
Origin
Germany is the birthplace of trance music,[3]:251 with the original melodic sound first appearing around 1992 in Frankfurt.[1]:15
Some trace trance’s antecedents back to Klaus Schulze, a German experimental electronic music artist who concentrated on blending minimalist music with repetitive rhythms and arpeggiated sounds. In France, Jean Michel Jarre, an early electronic musician,[4] released two albums in the late 1970s: Oxygène in 1976 and Equinoxe in 1978. Also a possible antecedent, Neil Young’s 1982 electronic album, Trans, bears a resemblance to the trance music genre.[5]
Examples of early Trance releases include but are not limited to German duo Jam & Spoon’s 1992 12″ Single remix of The Age Of Love.[6]:15, German duo Dance 2 Trance’s 1990 track “We Came in Peace”,[3]:251 Also, Hi-NRG is also often regarded as the origin of the earlier forms of vocal trance music.[by whom?]
As for the roots of contemporary trance, some[by whom?] trace it to Paul van Dyk’s 1993 remix of Humate’s ‘Love Stimulation’.[6]:15. In subsequent years, one genre, vocal trance, arose as the combination of progressive elements and pop music, and the development of another subgenre, epic trance, had some of its origins in classical music.[1]:15, with film music also being influential.[2]:35
Here are some samples:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HZrcp1pdUDk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TM9qW87QB0A&feature=related
Another matter that I wanted to bring up… why is it so very important that music we listen to have a blatant White Nationalist theme to it? European Classical rarely had a White Nationalist theme, although the pride of country and culture was all wrapped up in the music and the composer. Trance is only made by White guys, and will hopefully remain that way. The listening audience does have a wide variety of races and ethnicity, only because it’s the only alternative to Black Hip Hop and the whiny, strange and degenerative pop music of today. There are very few Blacks who listen to Trance, but many Asians, Semitic, and Hispanic do listen to and like Trance. But I would have to say that the largest audience would have to be White young people, mostly in Europe.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u6-rmA_XhYc&feature=related
@me:
me – I’m sorry I shouldn’t have singled you out. I suppose the reason is that you had seemed to establish yourself as the more senior individual (whether age, intellect, education etc). Because to the extent we are all here we all have shared insights, interests, objectives, and so on, in my mind that sort of put the responsibility onto you, to get a good outcome from the conversation.
I have thought about what you are saying, and although I don’t have a problem with any of it on its own terms, what I do say is that your judgements seem not wholly to be taking account of the actual situation we find ourselves in as a people.
For example, do you really think it is feasible that somehow a mass internal struggle between whites can take place, culminating in the expunging of bad cultural memes planted onto us by our enemies, resulting in a return to unity on a platform of 4 generations ago?
And then, *then*, having done that, to take on our enemies and take back our destiny? I find it so hard to envisage that, ‘me’. I mean, look at us, you won’t even give your real name and nor will I.
Sure…I hear you and the others that black metal is symptomatic of the cultural warfare that has been waged against us to such devasting effect. But surely, the realistic way to proceed is to accept that we have been changed. And that any turnaround, any sort of fightback, will have to come from the ranks of what we are. That unity will have to be found between white folk many of whom are damaged property in one way or another.
I asked you before whether you’d prefer a black metal fan who had woken up and realized the peril the white people are in, or a best-cultured person who embraced multiculturalism and hated her own people. The answer you gave was actually very good and true: clearly, we need to reach them both.
But let me ask you ask a slightly different question about our two imaginery friends: which one do you think has a better grasp on the real world?
@Mickey Meadows: That was a funny video about Women Know Your Limits. I miss the days here in the US when you could laugh about gender differences without fear of being destroyed.
@Jason Speaks:
while you’re in the mood the same team did this one which is also funny http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZ0jRuASVEQ&feature=related
@Mickey Meadows: Hilarious! Actually quite a bit of truth to it.
@Mickey Meadows:
Let’s take the example out of control sexual promiscuity. (Let us assume that we all understand this one of the hallmarks of declining cultures) . Is the way out to say ‘oh well you know they’re like this now, not much to be done’ and offer a softer pornography? Does that bring us any closer to restoring families and monogamy and healthy male/female unions?
It’s hard to test in a laboratory, but my own observation is the ‘rock and roll’ lifestyle is extremely destructive. Black metal certainly has elements of nihilism, drug use, and yes, satan worship, and rabid hostility towards Christianity.
Just look at some of the posters here – they can’t even say “Jesus” they have to say “jebus’ “jew desert god’ ‘your jew worship religion’ – do you honestly think this is helpful or that these people are even mentally balanced?? It seems to me that lifestyle and identity encourage this anti-social anti-intellectual behavior.
The question then is not if someone happens to listen to some of this stuff some of the time, the question is whether, as this article and this site often imply the claims that it is somehow leading young people to an awakened conscious. As with my earlier video game example, my gut tells me a resounding no.
Take the example in the black community of hip-hop gangstas on one side and the nation of islam on the other. If the N.of Islam ? who do you respect? Who do you think has a better chance of turning that community around? (I wish Christians in the black community would do a better job)
@baaltanit:
Religion makes for poor science, but science even poorer religion. Many conflate or confuse the two. Many have made Gods of reason, science, rationality.. and we all know the aftermath: the reign of terror, the Bolsheviks.
There are plenty of scientists who believe in God, Christianity through and through and many who have come to belief in God after being atheists through science. Many intelligent men have started life as atheists (CS Lewis) and ended up Christian. You can easily find plenty of good books on the subject, written by believing scientists. The two are not in conflict. the media likes to make it so.
Metaphysical questions, questions of the human condition, spirtual matters cannot be answer by science. Nor can throwing out 1500 years of insight, theology and philosphy from the likes of Aquinas , Augustine, Luther, Kierkegaard, etc. advance spiritual thought much. Start with that framework. There are many great confessions to read too – ST. Theresa, Augustine, and so on.
@Pierre de Craon:
If I had your writing ability, I’d be better able to express my gratitude for your kind, thoughtful comment; it made my evening.
Even before I started commenting on this website, I always noticed your comments; they stand out in a great way.
It’s not just your writing ability. You have a good spirit, and I’m grateful this movement has people like you behind it.
Sincere thanks.
@ Mickey: Good one…
Women have been tricked into feminism, and men have been told to find their “feminine side” which is appalling.
The whole gender confusion is because people look to the media instead of following their own lead.
@me:
It is really funny how you hate rock’n'roll. It betrays your age or at least your mindset has been stuck into a certain age. In the 1930s Jazz was abhorred by ‘descent people’ and National-Socialist were firmly against it. KMAC also liked jazz and was even a jazz pianist for a while. Is he a bad person now? I would say no.
In the 1950s rock’n'roll came up and was abhorred by ‘descent people’ but now there are few conservatives who reject Elvis Presley. He has become a classic icon of 1950s America. Since then rock has evolved and the boundaries are constantly redefined.
Concerning the perceived anti-Christianity: most of these words are meant to shock although the shock-effect is declining in our post-Christian era. It is 90% of the time just posing. Besides Christianity in its current state is a mockery anyway.
If you accuse rockers of drug-abuse and promiscuity then you are very ignorant. Although artists ususally lead a messy life (just like most artists in general), most fans don’t. I am a fine example of that and most of my friends also have settled down as they grow older, get a job and have a family. Besides, there is a strong current within rock which is against alcohol, drugs and promiscuity:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straight_edge
My final argument is that classical music is also corruptable. The ‘Rite of Spring’ of Stravinsky was considered offensive and its first performance ended in a riot in 1913. Modern classical music is also a cacophonie of sound. Where do you draw the line ‘me’? Do we include Wagner with its themes on Norse mythology?
@Lancashire lad:
Saga
@me: oh yeah, they’ve (Pierce’s NA) done wonders haven;t they. Big national party and all that. ..
Pierce’s name will live on for his achievements for our race long after me’s is quietly forgotten. Has me done anything even remotely comparable?
Would we rather not have the support of our current and former youth who may have come along due to his efforts to link the message with rock music?
Any WN anonymous internet blowhard who disparages the work of great men like DWP while spending his life in obscurity and inaction quite frankly comes off as an *sshole.
It’s like one declaring himself superior to Napoleon after winning a game of solitary Risk.
me is obviously a very smart fellow. Why can’t he see this?
@Dirk:
And since the 1950s, hand in hand with the rock n/ roll lifestyle, drug user and alchol abuse have increase literacy has declined, promiscuity has increased, almost every measurable social standard has declined in quality and value. Our society in unraveling and falling apart at an unprecedented rate.
Is this your defense?
Actually I listened to punk rock, new wave, ‘classic’ rock growing up. That should betray my age range. Younger than the baby boomers, generation ‘x’ if you will. I was able to compare the baby boom generation, who were older than me, with the generations before. The baby boomers always suffered by comparison. Smug, ill mannered, selfish, greedy, unethical, cynical.. I can’t think of enough bad adjetives to describe that generation.
Of course there are many of that age that are not that way and many my age and younger that are worse. But I do think you can pin some characteristics and social change on certain generations and the net influence of the baby boomers has been disastrous.
@Matthias:
That is, of course, if I declared myself ‘superior’ to anyone. Are you having a discussion with someone? Not me, certainly.
We were discussing the effectiveness of strategies. If I say Napoleon made a mistake to over-extend his cavalry at Waterloo, that is an opinion that in no way implies I am superior or in anyway like Napoleon, but many people who analysed the battle might agree.
If I say, “after that he was never able to field an army again’, likewise, that is not declaring myself superior to Napoleon, it is stating my opinion as to the outcome of Waterloo.
@baaltanit: Thanks for the heads up. Traditional Scandinavian folk music has a great new found appeal to me. I’m familiar with many of the excellent Celtic bands and music out there, but I’m rather surprised that I could remain so ignorant about (or uninterested in) Scandinavian music for so long. Thanks again.
@me ; I have nothing valuable to contribute here except to say that I wholeheartedly agree with your standpoints and arguments, no matter how harshly they are perceived (and I’m a 20 yr old, nonChristian female, if that matters to anyone). Your ceaseless rebuttals may grow tiring but they haven’t up until this point been anything short of cold hard reality!
@Jim:
Ok. If you’re really really interested,
Check out the following:
Varttina (Finland)
Vasen (Sweden)
Hoven Droven (Sweden)
@Dirk:
Check out this article on Nazi Straight Edge:
http://wnthinktank.wordpress.com/2011/10/23/a-step-up-the-knowledge-pyramid/
@Jim
Check out:
Lumsk
Arkona
They are viking metal from Norway, and Russia respectively but they infuse so much traditional music that they are actually masterful at traditional and metal. So they have reached the pinnacle of awesomeness. \m/
Now if you want to see some smokin’ hot metal vids go to youtube and look up:
Amon Amarth
Tyr
Eluveitie
Arkona
Behemoth
\mm/ (too much metal for one hand)
Another type of White music that could be used is Country Western. Blacks hate it, but almost every other groups either likes it or is neutral about it.
One thing I point out to feminazis who hate Whites is that unlike rap, heavy metal, and rock, country western singers are 50 percent women, 50 percent men, the perfect quota that the feminazi commies strive for.
It’s good to see a racial consciousness developing in some sphere of music. But I hope the metal kids can learn to turn it down so that, after it’s all over, they can be functional human beings. Things like being able to carry on a conversation, understand their comrade in battle or canny doings, or a White mother being able to hear her baby stir in the next room. Important stuff, it is. I am sure glad that I stopped exposing myself to that stuff in time to keep a functional level of hearing. But even now as I type, the tinnitus squeals.
I can’t respect any kid who burns down the churches of his grandmothers and grandfathers. I saw one band had a group of old bagpipers out on the stage them. That was a beautiful sight.
I used to be a metalhead, and even now I listen to a lot of that stuff (maybe 20% of the time I listen to music), although now I’m more into martial/industrial/neofolk/military pop/etc. type of music, and recently I started listening to baroque as well. (I now probably listen to more baroque than metal… getting older, probably.)
It’s a good thing that there is some (implicit and occasionally explicit) White racial consciousness in metal music, but I don’t think it will ever be more than a minority subculture, and I wouldn’t like to make it too deeply intertwined with the WNist movement.
I don’t want to frighten away non-metalheads from the WNist movement, and I also don’t want to frighten away non-WNists from metal music. It’s best to keep both just very loosely associated in a kind of assimetrical way: those listening to metal being exposed to WNist thoughts (even if they have never been into WNism before), while at the same time WNists not being exposed to metal too much (so that you don’t have start listening to it if you just don’t like it). If you’re not into this music, it’s probably not for you.
Burzum is NOT racialist and Vikernes does NOT promote National Socialism on his site! Try reading his article, The Nazi Ghost, which is on his site.
@Richard: The sentiment is mutual, Richard. And thank you.
What the members of these bands need is one round of .45 ACP right to the center of their foreheads.
White nationalists who completely disregard the utility of black metal because its too unsophisticated or boorish are complete idiots by and large. Read Rabelais if you are a fool who has some nostalgic postage stamp conception of western cultural purity before the 20th century. There have always been rougher, bawdier, ‘baser’ forms of cultural expression, ALWAYS.
Do you have any idea how many dick jokes are in Shakespeare? Would you still include him in the western cultural canon, if you knew how gross and impure his plays are? Cause, you know, they might encourage bad lifestyle choices. LOL
Also don’t forget that there are overtly National Socialist folk metal bands out there like:
Nokturnal Mortem
Temnozor
And loads of National Socialist Black Metal!
Hail NSBM!
Death to music!
@baaltanit:
Sorry to respond so late. I hadn’t checked this thread in several days. All of these references are greatly appreciated. I was involved with music as a career for many years (not as a performer.) I’m backlogged with activities over the holiday, but promise to investigate these groups and songs soon.
@germanen
I am listening Wagner’s music now. Is not that the ‘hard rocking’ classical music of the 19th century?
“The first band to herald the age of Viking metal was the Swedish band Bathory (1983–2004) with its release of the album Hammerheart in 1990. ”
Wrong. Manowar was earlier.
@Volksverhetzer: Garmarna dosn’t have the original, this is an really old song.