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Ross Douthat in the NYTimes: Is Civil War Coming to Europe?

June 4, 2025/7 Comments/in General/by Kevin MacDonald

Is Civil War Coming to Europe?

…

When I’ve written skeptically about scenarios for an American civil war, I’ve tended to stress several realities: the absence of a clear geographical division between our contending factions; the diminishment, not exacerbation, of racial and ethnic polarization in the Trump era; the fact that we’re rich and aging and comfortable, not poor and young and desperate, giving even groups that hate each other a stake in the system and elites strong reasons to sustain it; the absence of enthusiasm for organized communal violence, as opposed to lone-wolf forays.

Does the European landscape look different? On some fronts, maybe. Tensions between natives and new arrivals are common on both sides of the Atlantic, but ethnic and religious differences arguably loom larger in Europe than they do in the United States: There is more intense cultural separatism in immigrant communities in suburban Paris or Marseilles than in Los Angeles or Chicago, more simmering discontent that easily turns to riots.

At the same time, British and French elites have been more successful than American elites at keeping populist forces out of power, but their tools — not just the exclusion of populists from government but also an increasingly authoritarian throttling of free speech — have markedly diminished their own legitimacy among discontented natives. This means that neither underassimilated immigrants nor working-class white residents feel especially invested in the system, making multiple forms of political violence more plausible: pitting immigrant or native rebels against the government or pitting immigrants against natives with the government trying to suppress the conflict or, finally, pitting different immigrant groups against one another. (English cities have already played host to bursts of Muslim-Hindu violence.)

Then, too, Western Europe’s economies have grown more sluggishly than America’s for the past decade, reducing ordinary people’s stake in the current order and encouraging alienation and resistance. Finally there are arguably geographic concentrations of discontent — in the north of England or in immigrant-dominated cities that Betz warns could become ungovernable — that don’t exist in quite the same way in the United States.

All of this adds up, I would say, to a useful corrective to the progressive tendency to regard America in the Trump era as a great outlier, uniquely divided and deranged and threatened by factional strife, while liberal politics continues more or less as usual among our respectable and stable European allies. Not so: There are clearly ways in which Europe’s problems and divides are deeper than ours, with economic and demographic trends that portend darker possibilities, and the establishment attempt to keep populist forces at bay may end up remembered as accelerating liberal Europe’s downfall.

Yet many of the reasons to doubt the imminence of civil war in America still apply to Western Europe. The continent is more stagnant than the United States but still rich and comfortable and aged, there’s enthusiasm for rioting but rather less for organized violence, and for all the palpable disillusionment it is hard to glimpse any elite faction yet emerging — right or left, nativist or Islamo-Gauchiste — that would see violent revolution as an obvious means to its ambitions.

Meanwhile, there are distinctive European conditions that make civil war less likely there than in the United States: Smaller nations with more centralized political systems generally find it easier to police dissent, and there’s no Second Amendment or American-style gun culture to challenge the European state’s monopoly on force.

 

Ultimately I agree with the British writer Aris Roussinos, a pessimist but not a catastrophist, when he writes that the most likely near-future scenarios involve increasing “outbursts of violent disorder” but not the kind of collapse of central government authority, complete with ethnic cleansing and refugee flows, that the language of “civil war” implies.

And that imprecision matters: As I suggested before, if you use a civil-war framing to describe a world where rioting is more commonplace and assassination attempts and random forms of terrorism make a comeback, you’re describing realities that big, diverse societies often have to live with, using terms that misleadingly or hysterically evoke Antietam or Guernica.

I don’t think America in the 1960s and 1970s experienced a civil war, even though those were certainly chaotic decades. I don’t think modern France, with its long tradition of student protests and urban riots, has existed in a perpetual state of civil war. And as we face a future that’s clearly more destabilized than the post-Cold War era, it still behooves us to be realistic about the most plausible scenarios: We are still far more likely to be navigating a more chaotic landscape together as fellow citizens than shooting at one another across a sectional divide.

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https://www.theoccidentalobserver.net/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/TOO-Full-Logo-660x156-1.png 0 0 Kevin MacDonald https://www.theoccidentalobserver.net/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/TOO-Full-Logo-660x156-1.png Kevin MacDonald2025-06-04 10:52:502025-06-04 10:52:50Ross Douthat in the NYTimes: Is Civil War Coming to Europe?
7 replies
  1. Henning
    Henning says:
    June 4, 2025 at 1:52 pm

    Manspreading in Swedish: these are four Social Democrats from the Riksdag (parliament). Sanna Backeskog (second from right) has helped to introduce a new law that makes men liable to prosecution if they tell onlyfans women what to do, even though exactly this is often their business model (for example, German “celeb” and mother of three Anne Wünsche “earns” €60,000 a month by posing n*ked). https://i.ibb.co/fY57tD5Z/swedishequality.jpg

    https://linkmix.co/39143730

  2. English Patriot
    English Patriot says:
    June 4, 2025 at 2:13 pm

    Linked with David Betz on vulnerability to insurgency, this is an important article, given the negligence over foreign immigration, illegal and legal, with the risk of sleeper terrorism, importation of weapons or dangerous materials including poisons. The liberal/Christian mindset is no asset.

  3. Jank
    Jank says:
    June 4, 2025 at 3:57 pm

    Dr MacDonald, you forgot about organization. There are simply no organized opposing forces, although I think the numbers are there for a new political party that could potentially set off some things similar to civil conflicts like the troubles in Ireland, or maybe the early days of the German Workers Party. Atomized, and disorganized, no one wants to go to prison for political violence especially if it has no effect. Right now all I hear all dissidents tearing everything down without one word about possible solutions. The jews see this, and will keep raping us until there’s some kind of organized push back.

  4. Freddy
    Freddy says:
    June 4, 2025 at 5:56 pm

    In reality, Micro-Macron’s “wife” reigns over France,
    who admonishes him here in a very physical manner:
    “Stop grabbing my dick all the time, you tiny faggot!”
    https://x.com/TheSun/status/1926939615841190345

  5. Emma Smith
    Emma Smith says:
    June 5, 2025 at 5:15 am

    Douthat is a Catholic, but this is a clear-sighted article. The imported alien clusters in Europe are sources of potential street-war (e.g. Kashmir) but also “ordinary” crime (e.g. Gypsies) and terrorism (e.g. ISIS) in addition to drug dealing. The “authorities” are still enforcing “inclusion” against the indigenous interest, whereas “exclusions” are essential.

  6. Freddy
    Freddy says:
    June 5, 2025 at 11:43 am

    A firehead with a German name fits the predator-prey scheme of illusionary gynocentric and obsessive foot fetishist Kyle Hunt perfectly. Whether she would be willing to take on the role of his ex-Lilith Sinead, however, is so far a magically guarded secret that only he, the White Knight himself, is in a position to disenchant. As a vamp and femme fatale, she has all potential to fulfill his desire for total obedience, bewitchment and victimization.

    One of her strongly feminist “heroines” series is called “Amazons”. This announcement alone should trigger ecstatic dreams of total worship, bondage and self-sacrifice in Florida, and Hunt wouldn’t even have to go to Europe, as the witch lives in Vancouver. Traveling this distance is possible, but shipping her worn high-heeled shoes, in which residual traces of her intensely cheesy and spicy witch sweat can be sniffed, would be even cheaper.

    https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLteESDDVIavQ0AL97oMmepC1CSxFxlKh1
    https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLteESDDVIavTFmp7mnDTuyX8Q9Z1Z7Nvh

    • Emma Smith
      Emma Smith says:
      June 6, 2025 at 3:03 pm

      @ Freddy
      How does this throw light on or affect civil war in Europe?

Comments are closed.

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